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  #19751  
Old 10-27-2019, 08:19 PM
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Bill share seems to work for Christian heath care groups like medi share . Samaritans ministries and others. Why not nationally?
  #19752  
Old 10-27-2019, 09:05 PM
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Originally Posted by gphockey View Post
Bill share seems to work for Christian heath care groups like medi share . Samaritans ministries and others. Why not nationally?
https://time.com/5516037/gofundme-me...one-third-ceo/
1/3 of GoFundMe requests are for medical debt. This asinine idea that you get to pick and choose who you help (Samaritan ministries, GoFundMe) instead of spreading the payments across the entire populace (taxes) is already a thing. And it doesn't work particularly well, because if you aren't a particular religion (Samaritan ministries, which is bastardization of the term BTW) or don't know the right people (GoFundMe), then you are SOL. I'd love to know a) how much charitable organizations are paying to help people per year, b) the amount of crowd sourced healthcare coverage paid per year, and c) the amount of medical care related bankruptcies per year despite a and b. Because that will tell you how big the delta is. I suspect it is massive.

You could argue that the private sector, and market forces were never truly unleashed on the problem, as the inability to sell across state lines, the opacity of the pricing schemes, divorce of the consumer from knowledge are all anti-competitive, ant-market factors; but to argue that crowd sourcing is going to fill in the gaps doesn't come close to passing the smell test.

It's the same argument that people don't want their taxes to go to the poor because charitable organizations should handle it. But they don't. The need is too great. And if nobody is obligated (like the Local,State and Federal governments), then nobody will well and truly pick up that slack. If you don't want the market to solve the problem (and there are really solid arguments on both sides as to whether the market even CAN solve the problem), then Medicaire for all may really be the most effective solution. And since our Republican brethren thought that even attempting to solve the problem was a threat to the republic (ACA), then I can't imagine actually going for a straight market solution will ever be in the cards. So Medicaire for all it is. There is at least a logical argument underpinning it.
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  #19753  
Old 10-27-2019, 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted by dannybolt View Post
https://time.com/5516037/gofundme-me...one-third-ceo/
1/3 of GoFundMe requests are for medical debt. This asinine idea that you get to pick and choose who you help (Samaritan ministries, GoFundMe) instead of spreading the payments across the entire populace (taxes) is already a thing. And it doesn't work particularly well, because if you aren't a particular religion (Samaritan ministries, which is bastardization of the term BTW) or don't know the right people (GoFundMe), then you are SOL. I'd love to know a) how much charitable organizations are paying to help people per year, b) the amount of crowd sourced healthcare coverage paid per year, and c) the amount of medical care related bankruptcies per year despite a and b. Because that will tell you how big the delta is. I suspect it is massive.

You could argue that the private sector, and market forces were never truly unleashed on the problem, as the inability to sell across state lines, the opacity of the pricing schemes, divorce of the consumer from knowledge are all anti-competitive, ant-market factors; but to argue that crowd sourcing is going to fill in the gaps doesn't come close to passing the smell test.

It's the same argument that people don't want their taxes to go to the poor because charitable organizations should handle it. But they don't. The need is too great. And if nobody is obligated (like the Local,State and Federal governments), then nobody will well and truly pick up that slack. If you don't want the market to solve the problem (and there are really solid arguments on both sides as to whether the market even CAN solve the problem), then Medicaire for all may really be the most effective solution. And since our Republican brethren thought that even attempting to solve the problem was a threat to the republic (ACA), then I can't imagine actually going for a straight market solution will ever be in the cards. So Medicaire for all it is. There is at least a logical argument underpinning it.
Nice explanation. Alas, gp is seeking a simple solution to an extremely complex problem. I would be shocked if these cost sharing arrangements are organized as non profits at the state level or have been granted 501(c)(3) status by the IRS. There may be a few that are legit, but the scam potential is great. No regulation, no oversight, no tax returns.

Sounds like a great venture for the Trump Family business.
  #19754  
Old 10-27-2019, 09:20 PM
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These charities are fine, but donít think that they solve the problem.

An analogy would be Habitat for Humanity. They build 30 homes a year in Sarasota County. The problem is that Sarasota County needs more than 30,000 affordable units.

There is a dedicated funding source for affordable housing. If the legislature would let it be used for its intended purpose, we could construct about 300 units a year. Obviously still not enough, but ten times better than what we do now. But the legislature raids the funds saying that Habitat and churches should fill the need. Obviously they donít. (My favorite is that churches in low income areas should be a major source of the funding. Like low income churches have an extra $400,000 laying around to build 2 houses).

I suspect you have the same problem with health care.

By the way, if these organizations were the solution, we wouldnít be talking about a problem would we?
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  #19755  
Old 10-27-2019, 09:30 PM
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I take that back, itís not fine. It doesnít cover preventative care, it doesnít cover dental, mental health coverage, it doesnít guarantee, even after you pay into the plan that they will cover you.

They are also bigots. They wonít accept gay individuals or couples, if you smoke, you canít participate and if you arenít verified by a minister you canít join.

Itís also a high deductible insurance plan.

https://www.thepennyhoarder.com/save...share-reviews/
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  #19756  
Old 10-27-2019, 09:56 PM
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Quote:
President Donald Trump Booed at Game 5 of World Series
https://www.si.com/mlb/2019/10/28/do...tionals-astros

Quote:
President Donald Trump was greeted with loud boos from the crowd at Game 5 of the World Series between the Nationals and Astros on Sunday.

Trump was shown on the big screen at Nationals Park during the team's salute to veterans after the third inning. Fans in attendance loudly yelled "lock him up," a chant Trump supporters began in 2016 directed at his opponent and Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton.
I would like to revisit my preconceptions of Nats fans.

https://twitter.com/adamlongoTV/stat...877760005?s=20
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  #19757  
Old 10-27-2019, 11:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Donnie D View Post
I take that back, itís not fine.
Surprise, surprise. Sounds just like the crap that the insurance companies and their shills want. Medicare-for-All with the option for additional coverage via private insurance (buyer beware) I think is the only fair solution. I wish Bernie would back away from his stance that private insurance has to be eliminated. I don't expect that I'd have any interest in private insurance after being included in a Medicare-for-All plan but I don't have a problem with other people doing so if that's their prerogative.
  #19758  
Old 10-28-2019, 06:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Donnie D View Post
I take that back, itís not fine. It doesnít cover preventative care, it doesnít cover dental, mental health coverage, it doesnít guarantee, even after you pay into the plan that they will cover you.

They are also bigots. They wonít accept gay individuals or couples, if you smoke, you canít participate and if you arenít verified by a minister you canít join.

Itís also a high deductible insurance plan.

https://www.thepennyhoarder.com/save...share-reviews/
They deny payment if any of the medical issues are related to alcohol or substance abuse.

It is NOT insurance. Subject to no refs or requirements but it does qualify as an exemption for the personable responsibility for penalty when preparing your taxes.
  #19759  
Old 10-28-2019, 06:59 AM
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Donít overlook that he was accompanied by Graham, Gaetz, and Scalise. The four horseman of idiocy.
  #19760  
Old 10-28-2019, 09:16 AM
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So, stop ripping and check it out. You guys want health care, this works.

If you approached it from a secular point of view, would that change your opinion?
Think about it...no really, think about it.
Tens of millions, maybe and more likely HUNDREDS of MILLION of people supporting each other in healthcare. Is that so bad?
Now thats horsepower, and creates healthcare for all.
Whats so complicated that it won't work?

Oh, here is a down side. Medical establishments won't get paid until you receive your need check from....whoever from whereever, Cali, Col, Az, Fl, NY...from any resident from any of the 50 states. Those folks are notified by the office to where they need to send the check, directly to the person in need. Once you receive your checks, pay the bill.
Complicated?
Don't think so.
Need some issues worked out for national health care, sure, but I would say it would end up far less complicated than any other Govt program, and here is the kicker, its not really a govt program, although it could be administered by them, or private industry, you pick.

No checks to the "insurance Company" but directly to the patient so they may pay their obligation.
You are healthy, simply pay your share directly to the patients with need as directed by the office, and if you have a medical need, then you are now receiving the checks.

Seen it, done it, I know it works.

Last edited by gphockey; 10-28-2019 at 09:25 AM.
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