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  #1761  
Old 07-30-2020, 02:15 PM
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There is a work around of the work around though with the nuclear option

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filibuster

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The filibuster is a powerful legislative device in the United States Senate. Senate rules permit a senator or senators to speak for as long as they wish and on any topic they choose, unless "three-fifths of the Senators duly chosen and sworn"[57] (usually 60 out of 100 senators) vote to bring debate to a close by invoking cloture under Senate Rule XXII. Even if a filibuster attempt is unsuccessful, the process takes floor time.[58] Defenders call the filibuster "The Soul of the Senate."[59]

It is not part of the US Constitution, becoming theoretically possible with a change of Senate rules only in 1806, and never being used until 1837.[60] Rarely used for much of the Senate's first two centuries, it was strengthened in the 1970s[61] and the majority has preferred to avoid filibusters by moving to other business when a filibuster is threatened and attempts to achieve cloture have failed.[62] As a result, this has come to mean that all major legislation (apart from budgets) effectively requires a 60% majority to pass.

Under current Senate rules, any modification or limitation of the filibuster would be a rule change that itself could be filibustered, with two-thirds of those senators present and voting (as opposed to the normal three-fifths of those sworn) needing to vote to break the filibuster.[57]

However, under Senate precedents, a simple majority can (and has acted to) limit the practice by overruling decisions of the chair. The removal or substantial limitation of the filibuster by a simple majority, rather than a rule change, is called the constitutional option or, colloquially, the nuclear option.

On November 21, 2013, the then-Democratic-controlled Senate exercised the nuclear option, in a 52–48 vote, to require only a majority vote to end a filibuster of all executive and judicial nominees, excluding Supreme Court nominees, rather than the 3/5 of votes previously required.[63] On April 6, 2017, the Republican-controlled Senate did the same, in a 52–48 vote, to require only a majority vote to end a filibuster of Supreme Court nominees.[64] A 60% supermajority is still required to end filibusters on legislation.
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  #1762  
Old 07-30-2020, 03:21 PM
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Back in 2004, the rage in Democratic circles was George Lakoff's book "Don't Think of an Elephant" which attempted to explore how and why Republican political messaging was so much better than Democratic messaging. And, one of the big takeaways from that book was that what makes Republicans such a cunning and dangerous opponent is that neither their messaging nor their actual policy objectives are really moored to any principles or ideology. Literally everything they do is designed with the goal of giving them political advantages so they can stay in power.

For example, do Republicans really believe tort reform will solve health care costs? No. But they know trial attorneys are one of the Democrats' biggest sources of campaign contributions.

And there's a zillion other examples of the fact modern Republicanism is really just structured around the singular core principle of consolidating and keeping political power even if it's to the expense of the country. Mitch McConnell is the demon seed of this Republican approach to governance, and what he did as a political arsonist between 2011 and now is the greatest testament of all to the GOP's "power at all cost and nothing else" style of governance. This man deliberately knee capped the economy by adopting austerity policies in 2011 just to try to hamper Barack Obama's re-election chances, and stated as such publicly.

You cannot give that man a veto on the Democratic agenda if they sweep into unified control of the government in 2020 with enough seats (52 or 53 ought to do it for sure) to abolish the filibuster. He will knee cap the economy and our COVID-19 response deliberately just to try to re-seize the Senate in 2022 and the White House for his party in 2024. And, in the process, he will confirm a disillusioned populace's worst fears about the uselessness of Congress... where not even two straight blue wave tsunami elections can yield something better than frustration and gridlock. Democrats, being the party that still advocates that "good government" is possible can't allow that to happen and hope to have a leg to stand on in the long term when they try to compete at the ballot box.

And if/when they do abolish the filibuster, frankly I hope Democrats start to think about it a little more like how Republicans think about policy as a means to building durable political power. Now, the extreme example of that is if Democrats, today, decided to go full Mitch McConnell and refused to help pass another stimulus bill knowing the economic fallout would ensure their political victory in November even though it came at the expense of millions of Americans. I'm not in favor of that.

But, there's two policies in particular that the Democrats can enact in the first 100 days that not only help resolve pressing policy concerns of the day, but also will enfranchise millions of voters who skew Democratic and will help Democrats consolidate and keep power for a generation:

1.) A new and more muscular Voting Rights Act
2.) Immigration reform with a pathway to citizenship

And Democrats need to not be afraid of their shadows about short term political fallout knowing those two things above will keep them ascendant politically and help further the steady decline of Republicans as a national party. These are the right thing to do in terms of small "d" democracy and civil rights with the added bonus that they strategically advantage Democrats almost immediately. And that, IMO, is well worth any risk that comes with abolishing the filibuster. If McConnell had any mechanism to add millions of GOP voters to the roles they would do it, tout suite, without an ounce of hesitation. Schumer and the Democrats should stop trying to bring a knife to a gun fight and do what they need to do in this moment before 2022 or 2024 rolls around and they find out (again) that McConnell and/or the next Republican POTUS have no moral compunction about putting the screws to the Democrats whenever and however they can.
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Last edited by pete; 07-30-2020 at 04:45 PM.
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  #1763  
Old 07-30-2020, 04:13 PM
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We're already over 1,000 COVID-19 deaths again today, nationally, and numbers from Texas and California largely don't appear to be in the tally yet and will be coming tonight, I'm sure.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/

Florida took it on the chin again today, reporting 252 deaths very early this morning.
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  #1764  
Old 07-30-2020, 04:38 PM
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This one is for my man Zeyk. Miss ya, buddy. Come back before the election!

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  #1765  
Old 07-30-2020, 11:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pete View Post
Obama just endorsed doing away with the Senate filibuster in John Lewis' eulogy.
What a speech. He speaks with such power and control. You could feel the emotion and conviction. His love, respect, and admiration of Lewis was plain to see.

Honorable mention to G Bush. I can't stand his politics but at least you can see he's a decent man unlike our current 'leader' with his complete lack of caring.

BTW, Biden ought to nominate either of the Obamas as his VP, drop the mic, and walk off.

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Originally Posted by pete View Post
Mitch McConnell is the demon seed of this Republican approach to governance
Stella Immanuel would like to speak to you.
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  #1766  
Old 07-31-2020, 08:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pete View Post
Obama just endorsed doing away with the Senate filibuster in John Lewis' eulogy.

I told you, they won't let McConnell do to Joe what he did to Barack.

After years of not matching the threat to democratic processes from Republicans symmetrically, Democrats are finally starting to get on a war footing. And, yes, it has to be this way.
IF all this takes eliminating the filibuster -- another Jim Crow relic -- in order to secure the God-given rights of every American, then that's what we should do."

You missed the word if.
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  #1767  
Old 07-31-2020, 08:22 AM
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Originally Posted by the_narrow_way View Post
BTW, Biden ought to nominate either of the Obamas as his VP, drop the mic, and walk off.
He’s ineligible and the kids are too young. So I don’t know who the other is.
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  #1768  
Old 07-31-2020, 08:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donnie D View Post
He’s ineligible and the kids are too young. So I don’t know who the other is.
Not according to anyone I have heard talk, but really I would guess its either get Michele or none.

Last edited by BurnTHalO; 07-31-2020 at 08:33 AM.
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  #1769  
Old 07-31-2020, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Donnie D View Post
He’s ineligible and the kids are too young. So I don’t know who the other is.
A former President is technically able to be a VP, and the other option would be Michelle. For the record I don't think either will be picked I was just presenting a situation that I thought would be interesting.
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  #1770  
Old 07-31-2020, 10:56 AM
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If he picked Michelle, that would be a "drop mike" moment. I'd rather see her driving voter turnout in Ga and/or FL.
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