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  #20351  
Old 11-26-2019, 08:24 PM
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Donnie D Donnie D is offline
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Originally Posted by Bolthed View Post
Sure they do, but unlike 99% of corporations, they conduct their business in public and on broadcasts. Kind of a bad look to subjugate African Americans, don’tcha think? And thumbing you’re nose at the first amendment while enjoying a congressionally approved monopoly ... also not a wise move. But go on splainin the plantation owners’ rights.
The first amendment has nothing to do with employee / employer relationships. I would think you would know that.

Plantation owner rights? You are really comparing millionaires playing a kids game with slavery? Disgusting.
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Last edited by Donnie D; 11-26-2019 at 08:28 PM.
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  #20352  
Old 11-26-2019, 10:44 PM
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https://atlantablackstar.com/2014/12...us-of-slavery/

https://www.si.com/nfl/2016/11/16/se...rn-day-slavery

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/adrian-...n-day-slavery/

NCAA:

https://atlantablackstar.com/2014/02...-like-slavery/

Opinions backed by lived experience.
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  #20353  
Old 11-26-2019, 11:25 PM
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Getting paid millions to play a game a few times a year and can leave whenever they want, is like slavery

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  #20354  
Old 11-26-2019, 11:58 PM
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Originally Posted by RSchmitz View Post
Getting paid millions to play a game a few times a year and can leave whenever they want, is like slavery

If you wish to contribute something to this discussion, you get the role of a slave owner. You aren't really remotely qualified to speak to any other portion of this discussion.

Better yet, how about you just shut it instead of dismissing the opinions of African American men who actually have an idea of what they're talking about. The very fact that you think your opinion is worth anything more than a small amount of bird shit when compared to those of actual NFL athletes, speaks volumes.

I'm content with deferring to those who actually have lived experience on these topics. I'm not conceited enough to think I could tell a black man what it's really like to be an NFL athlete and be traded like meat at the combine after spending years(in most cases) working for pennies in relation to how much others make off of me.
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I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice... - MLK
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  #20355  
Old 11-27-2019, 09:32 AM
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RSchmitz RSchmitz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeykShade View Post
If you wish to contribute something to this discussion, you get the role of a slave owner. You aren't really remotely qualified to speak to any other portion of this discussion.

Better yet, how about you just shut it instead of dismissing the opinions of African American men who actually have an idea of what they're talking about. The very fact that you think your opinion is worth anything more than a small amount of bird shit when compared to those of actual NFL athletes, speaks volumes.

I'm content with deferring to those who actually have lived experience on these topics. I'm not conceited enough to think I could tell a black man what it's really like to be an NFL athlete and be traded like meat at the combine after spending years(in most cases) working for pennies in relation to how much others make off of me.
Feelings are valid, I am not questioning how anyone feels. However, arguing that they are in fact being treated like slaves is woo woo, and you need to be prepared to discuss why you believe that.
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  #20356  
Old 11-27-2019, 10:03 AM
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Donnie D Donnie D is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeykShade View Post
If you wish to contribute something to this discussion, you get the role of a slave owner. You aren't really remotely qualified to speak to any other portion of this discussion.

Better yet, how about you just shut it instead of dismissing the opinions of African American men who actually have an idea of what they're talking about. The very fact that you think your opinion is worth anything more than a small amount of bird shit when compared to those of actual NFL athletes, speaks volumes.

I'm content with deferring to those who actually have lived experience on these topics. I'm not conceited enough to think I could tell a black man what it's really like to be an NFL athlete and be traded like meat at the combine after spending years(in most cases) working for pennies in relation to how much others make off of me.
What a crock of bullshit.

You are deferring to a few multi millionaires who feel they didn’t get rich enough playing a kids game. They volunteer to participate in the NHL, get paid millions, can leave when they want and a hundred others are standing in line waiting to take their place. You know the common definition of forced slavery. That’s what you feel is the equivalent of slavery in our country’s early history.

Next we will get that movie stars are slaves because they are forced to work long days, under hot lights and members of the opposite sex ogle them. The inhumanity of man.

This one is an 11 on the Zeyk goofy meter.
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Last edited by Donnie D; 11-27-2019 at 10:09 AM.
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  #20357  
Old 11-27-2019, 10:36 AM
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Oh my goodness, are we really trying to call each other slave owners now? I mean, Zeyk has some points, but Lord the rhetoric is overwrought.

Here's where I think Zeyk is correct to point out the peculiar labor inequities of the NFL relative to other sports:

1.) The NFL is the only sport that requires athletes to go through three years of college before they're eligible for employment. Baseball and hockey you can go straight to the pros. Basketball just one year of college and they're about to walk that rule back.

2.) While in college, football players do get compensated in the form of tuition, room, and board, yes. But, it's pennies on the dollar compared to what the NCAA and its institutions rake in from big time college football. The average FBS program rakes in about $32M in revenue annually.

3.) When players get to the NFL, if they're lucky, they're locked into a rookie pay structure for the first three to four years where only the top draft picks are really making top dollar. The remainder are well compensated compared to the average blue or white collar worker, but you have to remember that money has to last a lifetime. For someone to live from their 20's to age 72 or 73, for instance, they have to save millions to make the calculus work.The average NFL salary is $2.1M, BUT, recall, that's skewed because those on rookie deals can't make as much. The last pick in the draft, for instance, will make more like $750,000 per year over a four year rookie deal. That's not chump change, mind you, but I would guess if you did the financial planning, for someone to live comfortably from their 20's to 72, they'd need to save, what, $3-$4M to make it comfortably (with, say, $90K of income annually)? The math doesn't work out.

4.) The NFL is peculiar to pro sports in that there are no guaranteed contracts. You get hurt, you get cut, and you're SOL. And guys get hurt. A lot. The average NFL career is 3.3 years.

5.) The NFL is also terrible in how stingy they are when it comes to pensions and health care plans once they leave the game both in terms of the high standards to get vested and the actual quality of the benefits, which makes #3 and #4 that much more difficult to swallow. The NFL's failure on the health care front is well documented:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/18/s...dickerson.html

The point being is that there are, certainly, aspects of the system that seem unnecessarily exploitative given the NFL generated $15B in revenue last year with a projected goal of reaching $25B in revenue by 2027 (spoiler alert: they'll almost certainly get it).

At a minimum, you'd like to see them bring certain aspects of the system (guaranteed contracts and health care being the biggest) into better alignment with other pro sports (and honestly, as the revenue behemoth, you can argue there's no reason NFL benefits shouldn't be the gold standard of pro sports).
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  #20358  
Old 11-27-2019, 12:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pete View Post
Oh my goodness, are we really trying to call each other slave owners now? I mean, Zeyk has some points, but Lord the rhetoric is overwrought.

Here's where I think Zeyk is correct to point out the peculiar labor inequities of the NFL relative to other sports:

1.) The NFL is the only sport that requires athletes to go through three years of college before they're eligible for employment. Baseball and hockey you can go straight to the pros. Basketball just one year of college and they're about to walk that rule back.

2.) While in college, football players do get compensated in the form of tuition, room, and board, yes. But, it's pennies on the dollar compared to what the NCAA and its institutions rake in from big time college football. The average FBS program rakes in about $32M in revenue annually.

3.) When players get to the NFL, if they're lucky, they're locked into a rookie pay structure for the first three to four years where only the top draft picks are really making top dollar. The remainder are well compensated compared to the average blue or white collar worker, but you have to remember that money has to last a lifetime. For someone to live from their 20's to age 72 or 73, for instance, they have to save millions to make the calculus work.The average NFL salary is $2.1M, BUT, recall, that's skewed because those on rookie deals can't make as much. The last pick in the draft, for instance, will make more like $750,000 per year over a four year rookie deal. That's not chump change, mind you, but I would guess if you did the financial planning, for someone to live comfortably from their 20's to 72, they'd need to save, what, $3-$4M to make it comfortably (with, say, $90K of income annually)? The math doesn't work out.

4.) The NFL is peculiar to pro sports in that there are no guaranteed contracts. You get hurt, you get cut, and you're SOL. And guys get hurt. A lot. The average NFL career is 3.3 years.

5.) The NFL is also terrible in how stingy they are when it comes to pensions and health care plans once they leave the game both in terms of the high standards to get vested and the actual quality of the benefits, which makes #3 and #4 that much more difficult to swallow. The NFL's failure on the health care front is well documented:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/18/s...dickerson.html

The point being is that there are, certainly, aspects of the system that seem unnecessarily exploitative given the NFL generated $15B in revenue last year with a projected goal of reaching $25B in revenue by 2027 (spoiler alert: they'll almost certainly get it).

At a minimum, you'd like to see them bring certain aspects of the system (guaranteed contracts and health care being the biggest) into better alignment with other pro sports (and honestly, as the revenue behemoth, you can argue there's no reason NFL benefits shouldn't be the gold standard of pro sports).
Well reasoned and stated.
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  #20359  
Old 11-27-2019, 12:58 PM
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pete pete is offline
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I should add one other thing that makes the NFL's situation unique: not even a hint of competition. Hockey and basketball, definitely, there are international avenues for young talent to play and make money. Baseball, honestly, I'm not sure if it's something that's really done where young talent leaves North America to play in Japan, but the point is those sports are internationalized. Not to the degree that soccer/futbol is, but there's actually revenue-generating large leagues in other countries. Not so with football. The NFL has a monopoly and football is a one country deal. And the NFL protects that monopoly with zeal (hence why there's never been a successful follow-up to the USFL after Trump screwed that league up).

So, again, that all ties into it having the appearance of being a somewhat exploitative model. It's not like Joe Middle Linebacker has any options at 17-18 years old other than to go to three years of college with barely a penny to their name (Mind you, I'll also tell you the word on the street is that it costs a P5 school $200K to buy a good DT recruit, so there is some under the table hanky panky going on), pray they don't get hurt and develop as a player, get drafted or signed to the NFL, pray they don't get hurt and develop as a player, and then hope they also beat the odds and have a solid 7-8 year career where they at least get to a second contract so they make veteran money and get vested.
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  #20360  
Old 11-27-2019, 01:04 PM
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War on Thanksgiving? Give me a fucking break. More fictional BS from the asshole.
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