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  #101  
Old 04-23-2013, 04:54 PM
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Coldrice Coldrice is offline
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Originally Posted by RSchmitz View Post
I see what your saying, but you can't sing Purcells praise on one hand and then bust on his value in the next breath. I'm not going to throw out any names, but you could always use him in a larger package.

In regards to the Malone buyout. I'm sure your aware that he's only making 2.5 million over each of the next two seasons. I'd look to free up cap room somewhere else based primarily on that, he isn't an entirely toxic asset either and might be tradable.
To be fair though Schmitz, it's his NMC/NTC in his contract that handcuffs Yzerman. Then the value/return, cap hit, and so on. Single biggest obstacle... the other parameters fall into line after that.

I believe its plausible to list 3 of the 12 teams on this 12 team list he can submit to Yzerman this summer as:

Pitt
Minny
Philly

The remaining 9 could be contenders (CHI, LA Kings, perhaps TOR ....)

So now Yzerman has the list. So, now we're into the following:

Cap Hit - 4.5M next 2 seasons (actual 2.5M)

Games played and production (last 3 years)

2010-11 - 54 GP - 14g 24a 38pts 51 PIMS 18 power play pts
2011-12 - 68 GP - 20g 28a 48pts 82 PIMS 15 power play pts
2012-13 - 23 GP - 5g 2a 7pts 22 PIMS 2 power play pts

Games lost - 67 games or roughly 1/4 of a season lost per season

And the other thing about Malone is, his peak and valley streaks (hot and cold) and injury time are literally carbon copy every single season. So all that aside for a moment, and strictly staying in the realm of the 12 teams he'd consider going to... we're speculating but, glance over the one's I mentioned and see if his salary/cap hit, they're roster make up, and his production can fit in. Then you'd have to contemplate returns. Diminished is the word that comes to mind.

To me it's far easier, (given all the dynamics) to essentially buy him out, a handshake and a thank you for your services pat on the back, and now you have 29 other teams you can pitch your ware's to. Only because I don't think you're going to get they value sought in return to let him go via trade, given all the parameters above.
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  #102  
Old 04-23-2013, 06:13 PM
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The Other Side The Other Side is offline
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Cut him loose. That would leave us a little room for the defense as we have the forwards that can come up and play.
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  #103  
Old 04-23-2013, 08:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RSchmitz View Post
I see what your saying, but you can't sing Purcells praise on one hand and then bust on his value in the next breath.
When did I bust his value? I'm sure has good value. I'm sure he can fetch another Brewer/Salo/Carle type defenseman. But, I don't think that's the kind of defensemen you are looking to acquire. So, will he fetch a mobile top pair shutdown defenseman that isn't past his prime? No, not on his own.

But if you argue that you attach a pick and a prospect to him, then now you are talking about a two-fold costly acquisition: (1) that's a lot to give up for a single player (assuming we are talking about a Top 60/90 pick and one of Connolly/Johnson/Palat/Panik), and (2) the contract attached to a defenseman of that caliber probably puts us back over the cap anyway. Which is why you grow these guys at home instead of trading/signing them.

Help me out, RSchmitz? I asked Pete the same question. Who are you looking to acquire. When you name a name, I'm not expecting it to be *that* player, but more of the level/type/peer of *that* player. I'm looking to see what the expectations are here, because I have a sinking feeling the expectations are higher that what Yzerman can realistically deliver. Are you talking Yandle, Suter, Weber, Chara, Doughty? What/who do you think we can trade for??
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  #104  
Old 04-24-2013, 07:18 AM
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RSchmitz RSchmitz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coldrice View Post
To be fair though Schmitz, it's his NMC/NTC in his contract that handcuffs Yzerman. Then the value/return, cap hit, and so on. Single biggest obstacle... the other parameters fall into line after that.

I believe its plausible to list 3 of the 12 teams on this 12 team list he can submit to Yzerman this summer as:

Pitt
Minny
Philly

The remaining 9 could be contenders (CHI, LA Kings, perhaps TOR ....)

So now Yzerman has the list. So, now we're into the following:

Cap Hit - 4.5M next 2 seasons (actual 2.5M)

Games played and production (last 3 years)

2010-11 - 54 GP - 14g 24a 38pts 51 PIMS 18 power play pts
2011-12 - 68 GP - 20g 28a 48pts 82 PIMS 15 power play pts
2012-13 - 23 GP - 5g 2a 7pts 22 PIMS 2 power play pts

Games lost - 67 games or roughly 1/4 of a season lost per season

And the other thing about Malone is, his peak and valley streaks (hot and cold) and injury time are literally carbon copy every single season. So all that aside for a moment, and strictly staying in the realm of the 12 teams he'd consider going to... we're speculating but, glance over the one's I mentioned and see if his salary/cap hit, they're roster make up, and his production can fit in. Then you'd have to contemplate returns. Diminished is the word that comes to mind.

To me it's far easier, (given all the dynamics) to essentially buy him out, a handshake and a thank you for your services pat on the back, and now you have 29 other teams you can pitch your ware's to. Only because I don't think you're going to get they value sought in return to let him go via trade, given all the parameters above.
I thought malones limited nmc went away after this season cold
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  #105  
Old 04-24-2013, 07:35 AM
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RSchmitz RSchmitz is offline
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Originally Posted by timothy View Post
When did I bust his value? I'm sure has good value. I'm sure he can fetch another Brewer/Salo/Carle type defenseman. But, I don't think that's the kind of defensemen you are looking to acquire. So, will he fetch a mobile top pair shutdown defenseman that isn't past his prime? No, not on his own.

But if you argue that you attach a pick and a prospect to him, then now you are talking about a two-fold costly acquisition: (1) that's a lot to give up for a single player (assuming we are talking about a Top 60/90 pick and one of Connolly/Johnson/Palat/Panik), and (2) the contract attached to a defenseman of that caliber probably puts us back over the cap anyway. Which is why you grow these guys at home instead of trading/signing them.

Help me out, RSchmitz? I asked Pete the same question. Who are you looking to acquire. When you name a name, I'm not expecting it to be *that* player, but more of the level/type/peer of *that* player. I'm looking to see what the expectations are here, because I have a sinking feeling the expectations are higher that what Yzerman can realistically deliver. Are you talking Yandle, Suter, Weber, Chara, Doughty? What/who do you think we can trade for??
Ive wanted hjalmarsson for the longest time, but each year his stock goes up and he is probably beyond our reach now.
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  #106  
Old 04-24-2013, 07:41 AM
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RSchmitz RSchmitz is offline
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The only #1 that i think we could possibly get for a fair price would be jack johnson, im more interested in acquiring a top 4 physical d.
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  #107  
Old 04-24-2013, 07:57 AM
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Hoek Hoek is offline
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I think Columbus is pretty enamored with him at this point, but I defer to Zo.

Maybe Hedman can get in Hjalmarsson's ear.
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  #108  
Old 04-24-2013, 08:27 AM
goldenbolt goldenbolt is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RSchmitz View Post
I thought malones limited nmc went away after this season cold
Malones limited 12 team selection starts this summer for the last couple years of the contract.
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  #109  
Old 04-24-2013, 08:31 AM
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The Great Zo The Great Zo is offline
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Originally Posted by Hoek View Post
I think Columbus is pretty enamored with him at this point, but I defer to Zo.
Johnson's almost certainly not moving. He's seen as a leader on and off the ice, and he's a huge minute-eater. If you're interested in Wisniewski, on the other hand... ( Howson!)
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