Presidential Debate #3(final debate): 15th Oct 2008; Hempstead, New York

[jaydeedub]

Fun begins at 9pm. Wonder how many will be watching this one, seems many people are already decided or the debates make no difference in their decision....anyhow they're suppose to have a little more interaction in this one, although I hope that means they both don't turn a little pity and start the negative attacks on each other. We'll see.

[Maverick9911]

This one kinda snuck up on me - feels like the second debate was a month ago.

Wonder if McCain will begin the surrender or set up one last barrage of vitriol.

[Sotnos]

I really didn't learn anything new in the last one, hope this one's a little more interesting/convincing.

[astro]

I really didn't learn anything new in the last one, hope this one's a little more interesting/convincing.

I wouldn't bet on it.

MSNBC covered a Palin rally and she said the same shit that they've been saying for the last couple months. I don't see them covering anything new. Supposedly, McCain is going to bring forth the Ayers/Obama connection. They will talk about the economy and blast the other's proposal.

In other words, :yawn:

[Sotnos]

I wouldn't bet on it.Oh trust me, I'm not holding my breath or anything! :D I'm mostly going to be turning in to see if it gets dirty or if anything else exciting happens.

[pete]

Supposedly, McCain is going to bring forth the Ayers/Obama connection.

He's an idiot to telegraph a punch like that.

[the_narrow_way]

His bluster cost him there. Obama kind of called him out for not looking him in the eyes. McCain pretty much has to throw some punches or he's going to look like a coward.

[aapbolt]

the ayers thing is a red herring...how appropriate. I had a prof in college who was a member of SDS at northwestern, that association did not make me a communist, in fact the guy told me in class one time that"come the revolution I would be the first person he shot" how funny. One thing that stands out regarding Obama is that he is thinking long term not short term and is looking to solve problems and create a better future. I like that type of thinking because that is what really works, short term solutions are never the best. As long as he cuts the budget and makes government more efficient he will be fine. His health care program is very workable, and something I have talked about for some time as the easiest way to get health care coverage for those out of work, it was also part of the original, if memory serves me correctly, that the progressive republicans put forth at the start of the Clinton admin, that Hillary rejected.

[aapbolt]

Cretins. what standard of measurement do they use to trash the education system? Japan, only the top 50-60% pf students get into high school there, Germany or other Euro countries are pretty much the same way. South america, has crap public schools and the pay is low, in Argentina from 04 to 06 no teacher in the public school system got paid, so how much teaching took place, plus the best schools are all private. In the US 100% of students go to high school and they compare these totals to other countries where that is not the case. How crappy and what a lie. If you want real competition in education then give ALL students, those in public, private, charter and those being home schooled the same damn test and then lets see what happens. how about a test based on reading levels. Hillsborough High School has 43% level 1 readers, that is the lowest level and another 25% level 2 readers, plus 55% of our students are on free and reduced lunch. Plant High School has no...NO level 1 readers and a small percentage of level 2 readers...that was last year, should our test scores be compared? Please how ignorant can you be. We were giving the PSAT today and we had to kick out of the testing a number of students who wanted to sleep and just christmas tree their test...let's compare that score shall we. Obama has it right when he said we have to get Parents to work with their children...but tell that to a single working dad/mom with two jobs trying to keep food in her kids stomach and clothes on their back. Oh let's use FCAT... of course this from the idiots who want Downs kids tested at the grade level equal to their age and their scores counted against your school score...gee that is really fair. they are talking around the issue, more money.. for what sure teacher pay based on what criteria? Get rid of bad teachers ...very definately, but how? the system is skewered now in order to protect teachers from lies and false statements, yet when real problems are brought forth they are swept under the carpet in order to protect the system. 30 to 40% or the students at HHS will not go to college yet they are all on a college prep track...how stupid. they need to be educated for the real world and given the tools they need to succeed, plus given trade and other educational opportunities to help them find jobs and more training after high school. but this requires long term not short term thinking and the willingness to move resources to provide differing educational opportunities to students who do not want to be on the college track. we also need to work on job opportunities via corporations who would be willing to develop education programs designed to develop better trained employees for their companies or for movement into paraprofessional fields. these are the things we need to be discussing not vouchers and not test that are not designed to see what we are doing but rather test what we are not doing.

[Hoek]

McCain looked rather unraveled to me, and stepped into pretty much every counterpunch Obama had waiting for him as he swung and flailed wildly.

[Maverick9911]

Yeah, right down to the Dr. Evil finger quotes when talking about a mother's health. Good way to bring in those women, Johnny.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EASpPlcVbdI

All I hear is Dean Wormer from Animal House. Zero..point..zero.

[jaydeedub]

Cretins. what standard of measurement do they use to trash the education system? Japan, only the top 50-60% pf students get into high school there, Germany or other Euro countries are pretty much the same way. South america, has crap public schools and the pay is low, in Argentina from 04 to 06 no teacher in the public school system got paid, so how much teaching took place, plus the best schools are all private. In the US 100% of students go to high school and they compare these totals to other countries where that is not the case......

Didn't want to quote it all, because it was so lengthy. Many/most of the figures the government uses in comparing the US education to the world comes from UNICEF, which has a lot of info on it. (http://www.childinfo.org/education.html) For me, I can't really agree with you on a few points. I lived in Europe (Italy) for 3 years and ALL of the Italian kids in our "Parco" went to school. They're education system is also set up a bit different, so it's hard to compare really. But they had no "middle" or "junior" high like we do. Also what we'd consider to be their high school, there's basically two types they went to: one was a trade school (which there were several different "trades") and the other was the more general type like we have. Also they all receive a foreign speech class, for at least 3 years and in some cases longer, like the Greeks told me in some cases 5 years. These classes are done in early education (primary) and it is of the recognized global communcations language of the militaries: English. Many Italian's I worked with knew the geography of the United States better than many Americans do. Also look how much the US spends on education when compared to other countries, figuratively speaking of course. For example, believe these are 2005 numbers, the US spent 69 billion on education and 419 billion on defense, where as the UK spent 77 billion on education and 37 billion on defense. For being the world leader I believe the US could do a much better job with education in many aspects.

As far as the debate went, McCain would've done better for me if he didn't turn so negative for soooo long. He had to :deadhorse: on Ayers and Lewis where as Obama barely touched on Palin and the negative attacks and remarks made at their rallies. Also, suppose it depends on what channel you watched, but CNN used the split screen for nearly the entire night, and McCain reactions to Obama were just bad, grumpy faced and rolling eyes left and right. Looked very bad. Not sure if the other networks did that or not.

[Maverick9911]

CNN Poll: Obama 58 McCain 31
CBS undecideds: Obama 53 McCain 22
MediaCurves independents: Obama 60, McCain 30

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrnmYe-xJio

Cause for concern: Barack Obama still can't close the deal in Utah. Very grim.

[Sotnos]

Japan, only the top 50-60% pf students get into high school there, Germany or other Euro countries are pretty much the same way.
The education systems are really different there though, as the stats you saw may be only talking about college track high schools & not what we'd call trade schools. It's more like 90% continuing if you take that into consideration.

Oh let's use FCAT... of course this from the idiots who want Downs kids tested at the grade level equal to their age and their scores counted against your school score...gee that is really fair.
Do they seriously do that? To what purpose? The only thing I can think of is to cut funding for not being an A school.

they are talking around the issue, more money.. for what sure teacher pay based on what criteria?
I think you guys all need more pay in general for the crap you have to put up with. How do you deal with 12 & 13 year old boys anyway, the most immature creatures on the planet? :D

Get rid of bad teachers ...very definately, but how?
Yeah, no one ever defines what "bad" is or how you'd measure it. I'd imagine they're talking about more testing, yipee. :rolleyes:

30 to 40% or the students at HHS will not go to college yet they are all on a college prep track...how stupid. they need to be educated for the real world and given the tools they need to succeed, plus given trade and other educational opportunities to help them find jobs and more training after high school.
I agree with you totally, I'm not sure why technical education has become such a dirty word in this country. It does a disservice to all students to have kids there that don't want to be there or aren't learning things that are relevant to them.

these are the things we need to be discussing not vouchers and not test that are not designed to see what we are doing but rather test what we are not doing.
Amen. I could go on and on about testing, but to take it back to the debate for a second, I came away more convinced than ever that Obama's my guy. I don't want to even HEAR about vouchers, which to me are nothing more than veiled attempts to funnel money from public schools to private ones, how is that supposed to help fix the public school system?

Good post aap, and I can understand why you'd be insulted since it seems like school "failure" is always tied to "bad teachers" instead of the ton of other problems that contribute to it.

[TexasBolt]

Cause for concern: Barack Obama still can't close the deal in Utah. Very grim.

The most famous black man in Utah is Karl Malone, and even HE'S a Republican.

[Maverick9911]

Good for Karl. He can have a beer with McCain this winter and share stories about how he couldn't win the big one either.

[Maverick9911]

These aren't photoshopped. I...I don't even know what to say.

http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll307/hillbillypharmacist/McCainWTF.jpg
http://images.dailykos.com/images/user/1054/mctongue.jpg

[pete]

I'm calling it. This one's done. President Obama.

I actually thought McCain was very good for the first 20 minutes of the debate. That was the best 20 minutes he's had since his convention speech. He really scored with his first run through "Joe the Plumber" and actually drew blood for the first time on Obama on the issue of taxes.

However, McCain had nothing else in his bag of tricks. It seemed like he invoked "Joe the Plumber" at least a half a dozen times over the course of the debate, and by the end you saw women voters in particular severely dialing down everytime he mentioned him because it basically became a political gimmick after a while. So, for whatever gains he made early, he squandered them by overplaying his hand.

Where McCain started to come off the rails was when the issue turned to Ayers and John Lewis' comments. I thought Obama rather neatly batted aside the Ayers charges, and I think the way he calmly, halfheartedly repudiated Lewis' statements really triggered McCain's temper. I think McCain felt his honor had been besmirched because Obama wouldn't give a blanket pardon to all the questionable things that have gone on in McCain and Palin's rallys and in McCain's commercials. At that point, McCain lost discipline and really came off the rails. And, because McCain is only running negative ads right now whereas Obama is running only 60% negative ads, McCain was not dealing from a position of credibility in the eyes of the American people.

After that, McCain acted like an angry, sarcastic, disrespectful, whiney jerk. He kept rolling his eyes. Twitching. Making faces. Interrupting. He was a total ass the final 40 minutes of the debate. Much worse than the first debate.

Meanwhile, Obama stayed calm, cool and collected. While McCain furtively flailed about trying to land punches against Obama, Obama scored big by simply presenting his policies and his plans. You got very little policy out of McCain in any of these debates. By the time Obama spoke about his plan to provide renewable energy, it was clear that Obama was on his way to knocking out McCain. Clean sweep. Obama was 3-0 in the debates and Biden was 1-0. Big game players rise to the occassion when the chips are down, and Obama/Biden proved that they were big game players in debate season.

The polls agree:

CBS News had Obama winning the debate 53% to 22%.

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/10/15/politics/horserace/entry4525171.shtml

CNN had it 58%-31%. No link.

Obama won CNN's focus group in Ohio by a 3:2 margin. Obama won MSNBC's focus group in Missouri. Obama even won the Fox News focus group run by Frank Luntz.

I really think this sealed McCain's fate. This is going to be a landslide.

[Maverick9911]

FOXNews.com
Wednesday, October 15, 2008

"Hip-Hop-Dancing Colin Powell Fuels Speculation He'll Endorse Obama"

"Colin Powell showed off his hip-hop moves at an 'Africa Rising' celebration in London Tuesday, fueling speculation that the former Secretary of State is about to endorse Barack Obama for president."


:faceslap:

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/15/colin-powell-fuels-speculation-possible-endorsement/

[RSchmitz]

I like how some of the analysts keep giving the debate to McCain the debate because "he threw the most punches". They just don't get it. Agree with everything said in here; I would like to know what the superintendent in D.C. was for, charters of vouchers. Not that it matters at this point.

[RSchmitz]

I especially like how McCain argued that he wasn't running a negative campaign, and then devoted most of the debate towards trying to smear Obama. People are stupid, but you have to believe almost everyone picked up on that. And that fact that McCain was rattled.

[Sotnos]

Yeah, he seemed on the edge of losing his temper a few times last night, I'm sure that didn't help him.

A couple of the panel on CNN said they thought Obama was "dry" and "profesorial". I didn't think he was dry at all, but I also don't get what's wrong with remaining calm, professional and speaking in complete sentences.

[pete]

Holy crap! Joe the Plumber is related to Charles Keating?

http://www.eisenstadtgroup.com/2008/10/15/joe-the-plumber-wurzelbacher-related-to-charles-keating-oops/

Really? Amazing.

I thought Obama looked a little tired throughout the debate, just like McCain has looked occassionally throughout the debates. A presidential campaign is a marathon.

[WaiverWire]

The biggest thing that I got from last night was that Obama has changed his tax plan......again. Just the day before he was claiming you would get a tax cut if you made $250,000 or less. In the debate that figure fell to $200,000. I was very surprised that McCain did not catch that.


Obama........"Number two, let's help families right away by providing them a tax cut -- a middle-class tax cut for people making less than $200,000, and let's allow them to access their IRA accounts without penalty if they're experiencing a crisis."



Source CNN transcript of the debate


http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/15/debate.transcript/index.html

[Sotnos]

Been his plan all along as far as I know, $200-$250k doesn't get a tax cut, but doesn't get them raised either.

[the_narrow_way]

I caught where Obama said $200k, but I think it was a slip, since he was using $250k for the rest of the night.

[Maverick9911]

It was a slip, like the references to Sarah Palin's autistic baby.

And the more I read/watch of this "Joe the plumber" he reeks of nothing more than a plant, or at the very least one of those "undecided" voters.

[Flycoon]

I caught where Obama said $200k, but I think it was a slip, since he was using $250k for the rest of the night.

That wasn't a slip, his plan has been cuts for those less than $200K, no increase until income exceeded $250K.

[Flycoon]

And the more I read/watch of this "Joe the plumber" he reeks of nothing more than a plant, or at the very least one of those "undecided" voters.

MSNBC interviewed "Joe the Plumber" this morning. Looks like 'rassler Steve Austin, speaks like him after a concussion. Only thing missing was beer chugging and a confederate flag.

[the_narrow_way]

That wasn't a slip
Thanks.

[Sotnos]

And the more I read/watch of this "Joe the plumber" he reeks of nothing more than a plant, or at the very least one of those "undecided" voters.
Here he is, I also wonder if he's for real.

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[pete]

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You make the call.

[pete]

Joe's NOT a licensed plumber. Funny, that. I would think that someone who was trying to buy the plumbing business he has worked for years for might actually, you know, be a licensed plumber.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/jonathanmartin/1008/Joe_not_a_licensed_plumber_McCains_enthusiasm_not_ diminished.html

Oh, by the way, while Joe the Plumber might not actually be a licensed plumber, he does just so happen to be a registered Republican.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/1008/Joes_registration.html

Put two and two together, folks.

[Maverick9911]

Wow, this is gold. Joe also owes back taxes and hates Social Security.

Hey McCain, here's your October Surprise - make Joe your VP.

Plunge, baby, plunge!

[WaiverWire]

Wow, this is gold. Joe also owes back taxes and hates Social Security.

Hey McCain, here's your October Surprise - make Joe your VP.

Plunge, baby, plunge!


And it looks like Joe's taxes are going up........and he can't even pay what he owes now :D

[RSchmitz]

Owing taxes and not being able to afford to pay them are entirely different WW.

Joe the Plumber is certainly decided on whom he wants to vote for.

[Bolthed]

Plunge, baby, plunge ... hilarious.

[Maverick9911]

Top Tampa GOP Figure Circulates Joke About Killing Obama
Posted Oct 15, 2008 by William March
Updated Oct 15, 2008 at 05:58 PM

Al Austin, a longtime, high-level Republican fundraiser from Tampa, today sent to his list of political contacts an e-mail containing a joke that refers to the assassination of Barack Obama.

When asked about the e-mail, Austin said it was a mistake and apologized and that he wouldn’t knowingly have circulated it. He said he planned to send an apology and retraction to the same e-mail list.

The joke concerns a group of schoolchildren discussing the definition of “tragedy” as opposed to “great loss” or “accident.” The punch line comes when one child says that if an airplane carrying Obama and his wife, Michelle, “was struck by a ‘friendly fire’ missile and blown to smithereens,” the event might be a tragedy “because it certainly wouldn’t be a great loss, and it probably wouldn’t be an accident either.”

Austin acknowledged sending the e-mail to his list of political contacts but said he forwarded it without fully reading it and didn’t know what it said. That list included at least two reporters.

According to the forwarding history on the e-mail, it had gone through at least two other individuals before being sent to Austin on Tuesday.

Austin, a prominent real estate developer long known as one of the state’s leading Republican campaign fundraisers, has served in recent years as finance chairman for both the national and state Republican parties.

What a classy guy!! And this from a GOP newsletter in CA.

http://www.bobcesca.com/images/racist16_400.jpg

...but in their defense, it was "just food, it didn't register as anything else"

Disgusting.

[Flycoon]

Wow, this is gold. Joe also owes back taxes and hates Social Security.

Hey McCain, here's your October Surprise - make Joe your VP.

Plunge, baby, plunge!

And (allegedly, still being confirmed) related by marriage to Charles Keating.

It just gets better and betterer. Owes back taxes but he is going to buy a business? Funny stuff, probably has a sub-550 credit report, "my friends".

[WaiverWire]

"It just gets better and betterer. Owes back taxes but he is going to buy a business? Funny stuff, probably has a sub-550 credit report, "my friends"."



Hey.....it's the American Dream :happydance:

[pete]

And it looks like Joe's taxes are going up........and he can't even pay what he owes now

Can't or won't?

If this is really a setup from the McCain campaign, then how frickin' dumb are they? At least Rove covered his tracks well enough it took a while before you could prove it was a setup.

[WaiverWire]

If this is really a setup from the McCain campaign, then how frickin' dumb are they? At least Rove covered his tracks well enough it took a while before you could prove it was a setup.

Us republicans are dumb, but not that dumb :melodramatic:

[Flycoon]

If this is really a setup from the McCain campaign, then how frickin' dumb are they? At least Rove covered his tracks well enough it took a while before you could prove it was a setup.

Us republicans are dumb, but not that dumb :melodramatic:

It's not that they are dumb, it's their arrogance that leads them to believe the voting public is dumb. The rabid culture of Caribou Barbie is a prime example.

[WaiverWire]

It's not that they are dumb, it's their arrogance that leads them to believe the voting public is dumb. The rabid culture of Caribou Barbie is a prime example.


works both ways :D

[Bolthed]

No, I've actually overheard "heartland folk" talk about Palin as a future president. Now THAT is dumb.

I tell people, I used to think Bush was dangerously stupid ... until I saw Sarah Palin.

[Avery86]

works both ways :D

I'm not really sure how you can keep trying to make us think you're still on the fence when it's pretty obvious you're not. It's ok to support McCain, WW.

[Hoek]

No, I've actually overheard "heartland folk" talk about Palin as a future president. Now THAT is dumb.

I tell people, I used to think Bush was dangerously stupid ... until I saw Sarah Palin.

At least Bush is trainable. Sheesh.

[WaiverWire]

I'm not really sure how you can keep trying to make us think you're still on the fence when it's pretty obvious you're not. It's ok to support McCain, WW.

did ya ever think that mabe since everyone, and I mean everyone, on this site is Obama that maybe I am just attempting to get another side here. My god, is that so bad. Can not anyone have a different view on something or are we all robots that must be exactly alike?

I have had some fun during a race that was lost several months ago. I bet others have had some fun also. Don't be so up tight. But some here make it like if you are a republican then you are a certain type of person, or follow GW.....that just is not so.

[Maverick9911]

John McCain just got roasted on Letterman.

Pathetic, both McCain and the fact Letterman asked more honest questions than nearly all so-called journalists this election season.

[WaiverWire]

I watched and thought we saw the real McCain.....a guy with a good sense of humor who enjoys life.

What are you all going to do in 19 days when you no longer have him to kick around?

[Maverick9911]

Celebrate.

And laugh at a news media licking President Obama's boots.

[pete]

McCain and Obama at the Alfred E. Smith Dinner roasting each other. This is funny stuff.

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My two favorite moments were McCain joking that even in a room full of Manhattan Democrats he couldn't help but sense there were some who were secretly rooting for him... and that he was delighted to see Hillary there. And then Obama talks about never having put lipstick on a pig, or a pitbull, or himself, and starts making fun of Giuliani. "Who would have thought that a cross-dressing mayor from New York City would have a tough time winning the Republican nomination? It's shocking. That was a tough primary you had there, John."

[pete]

What are you all going to do in 19 days when you no longer have him to kick around?

Celebrate for a couple of months, then get down to the business of holding Obama to his promises.

[Bolthed]

McCain was funnier ... but hey, he's been at it longer.

My two favorite moments were when each got serious at the end of their roasts. I can only dream of a presidential election that dignified.

[Sotnos]

did ya ever think that mabe since everyone, and I mean everyone, on this site is Obama that maybe I am just attempting to get another side here. My god, is that so bad. Can not anyone have a different view on something or are we all robots that must be exactly alike?

I have had some fun during a race that was lost several months ago. I bet others have had some fun also. Don't be so up tight. But some here make it like if you are a republican then you are a certain type of person, or follow GW.....that just is not so.I think you might want to re-read what he said: "It's OK to support McCain" and you jump down his throat?

[WaiverWire]

I think you might want to re-read what he said: "It's OK to support McCain" and you jump down his throat?

Well this is a typical response Sotnos. You only pasted the part that you want to read and for others to see. You so conveniently left off the part of accusing me of still being on the fence when in their opinion I clearly am not. That is what my response was directly at.

And guess what.......if I had to vote today I have no idea how I would vote. I like something about both and I dislike other parts. Yes, I have always been a big John McCain fan. However the country is in such a mess that we need to look for someone that might be able to come in for longer than one term.Don't think McCain fits this bill. I have wondered where is the John McCain we all know. The campaign has changed him from the clips that Pete posted and his appearance on Letterman. Sarah Palin, please what in the hell was he thinking? Thus is John McCain the one we need.

Barack Obama. Blast away, but I am one that wonders if a first time Senator is ready to lead us out of this mess. I do wonder about his choice of those he associates with. I do wonder about his choice of a Rev Wright. I do wonder about his land purchase from Tony Rezko. I worry about ACORN. I think it is great that everyone votes, but votes once. When I look at one, it doesn't look so bad, look at all and I wonder. But that is me, that is a product of the profession I was in for 32 plus years. But what worries me the most about Barak Obama are the names of Dodd, Franks and Pelosi.

So when I sit here wondering if I am even going to vote, don't judge me by a few words that can be left on a site that can not show the emotions that one can get when talking face to face. Why not try something new and take me for my word?

That Sotnos was why I posted what I did.

[WaiverWire]

Pete, thanks for those links. They were great. It is nice seeing that they can all sit down and have a meal and some laughs together.

[pete]

It is nice seeing that they can all sit down and have a meal and some laughs together.

Without preconditions, even.

[WaiverWire]

ah...a line I loved.

U.S Supreme Court just ruled that the Republican Party has no standing in challenging the Ohio Secretary of State ref the 200,000 ballots that may be bad.

Ohhhhh, I hope McCain does not enter the issue.

[pete]

The Chicago Tribune, which has never endorsed a Democrat in its history, endorsed Obama today. The Washington Post endorsed Obama yesterday. Not that newspaper endorsements mean much.

Three new polls have come out within the last week showing Obama either leading in North Dakota or tied. It's only 3 electoral votes, but it's still bad news for McCain. In addition, if you look at 538's model, McCain's only projected to win West Virginia by 0.6%. There's even some talk that Arkansas, which hasn't been polled in forever, may be very tight right now. It's triage for McCain at this point, and I don't understand why he's still spending boatloads of cash on Pennsylvania, though. Obama's probably going to win that state by double digits.

There's been some slight tightening in the polls over the past couple of days, but I have a feeling Obama's debate performance will probably push his numbers back up once the polling catches up with them. Rasmussen supposedly had a day's worth of polling showing a 9-10% lead for Obama the day after the last debate.

A couple of new Senate polls today. In Oregon, Jeff Merkley made modest gains. I'd say you can color that state blue on your scorecard. And, in Mississippi, Ronnie Musgrove is now down only 1% to Senator Wicker. I honestly cannot wrap my mind around the fact that Democrats are seriously competitive in Senate races in the deep red south like Mississippi and Georgia. Times are changin'.

[Maverick9911]

I loved the frenzy over the Drudge poll yesterday showing a two point lead. Talk about cherry picking. I came across a blogfeed today that read "McCain sees path to victory through rural Maine". :pound: I just want the next 18 days to fly by because I know the narrative is going to be about "underdog" McCain and his inevitable, media desired/fueled comeback.

That's amazing about the Tribune.

[pete]

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Is there a lab, or something, where the GOP grows these?

This is Congresswoman Michelle Bachmann from Minnesota today on Hardball doing her best Joseph McCarthy impersonation.

She looks like an absolute lunatic.

[Maverick9911]

I imagine the scene in The Matrix where Neo wakes up in the pod of goo.

Somewhere there's a field where she, Sarah Palin, Ann Coulter and Michelle Malkin were grown.

[the_narrow_way]

This is Congresswoman Michelle Bachmann from Minnesota today on Hardball doing her best Joseph McCarthy impersonation.
That B is a total nutcase. Investigate the liberals for anti-americanism? Jesus H Freakin' Christ. Grow up.

Then Matthews had Pat Buchanan on, who promptly gave back the smidgen of respect for him he had earned with me. :duh:

[TexasBolt]

did ya ever think that mabe since everyone, and I mean everyone, on this site is Obama that maybe I am just attempting to get another side here. My god, is that so bad. Can not anyone have a different view on something or are we all robots that must be exactly alike?

Speaking for myself here, I happen to like having a place where I can talk liberal politics and not have to deal with all the silly "debate". You look around the Internet and most message boards set aside for political talk get hijacked by hardcore right-wingers. Not people like you. I mean the tin-foil nutjobs who post every scurrilous blog link they can find and feign outrage day in, day out.

Another favorite tactic on these boards is people trying to pretend they're independent or undecided, and then posting completely from one side or the other. I think that's where you're falling into. We know you're conservative, you don't have to pretend like you aren't.

[WaiverWire]

"We know you're conservative, you don't have to pretend like you aren't."

Just because I am conservative does not mean I always vote that way. I am not a robot......I vote for the candidate that best fits my needs be it democrat, republican or independent.

[pete]

I just watched Real Time with Bill Maher. Kind of a treat because I don't get HBO at home.

First off, I love Senator Bernie Sanders. This guy, I swear, he's like a time traveler from the New Deal, and like I said, I love him to death. There are very few politicians with the stones to talk about the disparity of wealth between the haves and have nots in this country with the passion and clarity that old Bernie will, God love him. I can only hope the new generation of populist progressives like Sherrod Brown carry Bernie's mantle half as well once he retires and moves on.

Anyway, Frank Luntz was on and he predicted Obama will be president and nothing McCain does in the final two weeks will make a difference. He said Obama will win by 5-6% nationwide. Now, mind you, Luntz also thought Bush was going to lose in 2004, but it still has to hurt the GOP to see their wunderkind pollster say that McCain can't connect with voters and has no chance.

The New York Times tonight has an unsourced rumor that Obama raised $100M in the month of September. Given the amount of national ads I'm seeing, I believe it. He's burning up money at such a rate he must've raked in a king's ransom.

Rumors are abounding that the Colin Powell endorsement of Obama will drop Sunday on the talk show circuit. I'll be interested to see how the GOP reacts to this. Powell was screwed by the neoconservatives and sacrificed his own reputation to their foolishness in Iraq, so his opposition to McCain is not surprising considering McCain really is the most warmongering neoconservative candidate the GOP field had this year. But, I'll be interested (if it goes down) to see how the Republicans will react. My gut says they'll probably try to make the argument that Powell only endorsed Obama because Obama is black. That's an ugly road to go down, though, and I hope they don't try to push that through their talk radio empires. This is the same man (Powell) who Ronald Reagan once said he wanted to run for president, and a man who was far more loyal to the GOP than they deserved, quite frankly. It'd be a shame if they turned on him.

[Maverick9911]

The New York Times tonight has an unsourced rumor that Obama raised $100M in the month of September. Given the amount of national ads I'm seeing, I believe it. He's burning up money at such a rate he must've raked in a king's ransom.

Last night during the Rays-Sox game I swear he had like seven ads run in the first few hours. It was like he was competing with Frank Caliendo for commercial time.

I wouldn't be shocked at all if they play the race card with a Powell endorsement. I mean, Fox already started it with the whole dancing in Africa thing. Hopefully they give the guy a little more respect than that once he does come out. I remember a poll done a while back (it could've been during the primaries for all I remember) that said Powell's endorsement was one of, if not the biggest, names that independents were waiting on to assist with their presidential choice. Don't know if it matters much but I do remember it was bigger than Bill Clinton, Gore and some of the other luminaries.

I just came from a screening of W - I saw it because a lot of reviewers said it wasn't the typical Oliver Stone "liberal hitpiece" people expected. The performances were good, especially Josh Brolin as W and James Cromwell as GHW. It isn't going to appease the hardcore anti-Bush crowd expecting nothing but a savage parody, nor will it please the 20% who still love the man. If anything it makes somewhat of an attempt to sympathize with the man, especially in regard to his relationship with his father. Colin Powell has a large part as well and the film goes to great lengths to show just how conflicted he was in the Bush cabinet. There are a few moments where Stone lampoons Bush, sure, but if anything it goes after Condi Rice and Dick Cheney hardest (especially Condi). It's uneven and glosses over way too much (the elections of 2000/04, 9/11 and his days since the war are either ignored completely or barely mentioned) so I wouldn't recommend paying $9.50 for it unless you're really bored.

[pete]

I wouldn't be shocked at all if they play the race card with a Powell endorsement.

And if they do that, they're opening up a Pandora's box, because like you said independents do respect the man and maybe more importantly so does the media. I think there would be a backlash if they played the race card on Powell. He and Obama are probably the only two African American political figures who transcend their race, and in Powell's case he carries the endorsement of Ronald Reagan. I'm really eager to see how McCain tapdances around that landmine if the endorsement happens and the media asks him about it, because I do sense Powell's endorsement is a significant repudiation of the neoconservatives (of which McCain is a true believer). I think John McCain will really view it as a slap in the face.

There's a lot of conflicting points of view on the Democratic side about Powell given his involvement in the UN presentation that was a big step on the way to war. I found that the GQ article written about Powell in 2004 really put Powell into better perspective for me and definitely made him look a lot less sinister. There's a lot of sinners in Washington DC when it comes to the Iraq War in both parties, and if you're going to accept the endorsement/quasi-endorsement of guys like Dick Lugar and Chuck Hagel then why not Powell?

[WaiverWire]

OK, here we go again....the race card. You make it sound like racism is only a one way street.........those on your side of the road would never, ever do such a thing.

I invite you to click on this news link. It is a story done by Fox35 in Daytona of a 7th grader that wore a "Sarah" t-shirt she was given. When she got to school classmates called her a raciest for wanting "the Caucasian" in office.

http://www.myfoxorlando.com/myfox/MyFox/pages/sidebar_video.jsp?contentId=7664458&version=1&locale=EN-US

This is just sick....I could care less about the age of these kids. But just where do they get this stuff........tv, print or just piss poor parents?

If Powell comes out and endorses Obama.....who cares, that is his right. Powell is a great man, one I wished had run for Office. No one, and I mean no one has the right though to claim it is about race unless he says it is. But many, and some here, seem to believe that racism is an issue and it is can only be found within one party. And until they are willing to stand up and say that racism, no matter who is involved, is wrong it will never go away. Racism is not limited to those with certain party affiliation or skin color but is a cancer that can be inflicted in anyone.


And how about this one from TBO.com:

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/oct/18/owner-believes-lexus-vandalized-due-mccain-sticker/

Read the comments. those that claim to be on one side or the other make some pretty stupid comments. Some sick stuff from both sides.

[pete]

OK, here we go again....the race card. You make it sound like racism is only a one way street...

We'll see how the GOP reacts if Powell does indeed endorse Obama. I will let the events of that day speak for themselves when/if it happens.

When she got to school classmates called her a raciest for wanting "the Caucasian" in office.

Ah, so now you want to argue moral equivalence with... 7th graders? Seriously? 7th graders?

As for the whole burning of an American flag on the hood of the guy's car, which by the way had no witnesses, I'm sorry, that smells of shennanigans just like Joe the Plumber. I apologize, but flag burning isn't exactly an epidemic in the African American community. Seems like something someone would do to stoke the flames of the Republican base.

[Maverick9911]

But many, and some here, seem to believe that racism is an issue and it is can only be found within one party. And until they are willing to stand up and say that racism, no matter who is involved, is wrong it will never go away. Racism is not limited to those with certain party affiliation or skin color but is a cancer that can be inflicted in anyone.

I for one will never claim that racism is a one-party deal. I saw too many Dixie Democrats pull crap in the primaries to think otherwise, and when I read diaries about canvassed voters saying "We'll be voting for the n---er", I'm not pretending it doesn't exist on the left.

However, I think back to everything I have seen this campaign season regarding Barack Obama and his family. Shirts with the Obama logo and Curious George eating a banana. Stuffed monkey dolls with his stickers. Talking heads musing about terrorist fist bumps, militant black takeovers, Muslim (or Muslin) extremists plotting to takeover the White House, chicken and watermelon food stamps, congressmen/women going on live television and delivering divisive, corrosive and hateful language about how "un-American" Barack Obama is. That's only the tip of the iceberg and not something than can just be swept under the rug because of some seventh graders. It may exist on both sides but when one has made a noted history of fanning the racial fires in political campaigns, the old "well they do it too" just doesn't cut it (especially when so much of this is involved in actual campaign strategy or by way of surrogates). They pull this crap and then whenever Obama dares to say "Yeah, I know I'm not your typical candidate" when trying to introduce himself to the public, the GOP immediately bitches and says he's the one playing the race card. When you're the ones doing the majority of the mudslinging, it doesn't work that way and you can't just point the finger at lesser offenses (real or perceived) for absolution.

It isn't so farfetched for anyone to wonder whether someone may make an issue of a Powell endorsement. Hopefully they give the man more respect than they would otherwise.

[WaiverWire]

Point is Pete it happened. Where do the kids get it from? And with your attitude no wonder it is an uphill battle to move past this horrible attitude some people have.

Those of us that do not like racism need to speak up when others, no matter who they are, say anything or do anything that is racist. Make them feel unconfortable....maybe we can make a difference.

[pete]

And with your attitude

SEVENTH GRADERS, WaiverWire. Kids say and do stupid things all the time. That's why they're called kids. Does it make it right? No. But is it equivalent to an ADULT going to a McCain or Palin rally and screaming, "Kill him!" when Obama's name is mentioned?

True, I think some of the folks who attend McCain and Palin rally's with monkeys with Obama stickers on them or signs calling Obama a Muslim baby killer have the intellect and maturity of a 7th grader (actually, that's probably too kind) but still, they're adults. They don't have an excuse for acting like sociopaths.

P.S. Seventh graders don't vote. There, I left an opening for a cheap ACORN joke, just to make you feel better.

[Hoek]

At least she can change shirts to avoid the harassment. No such luck if she was truly getting grief for her skin color, or dare I say sexual orientation.

[WaiverWire]

I think you are missing my point Pete as I know she is only a 7th grader. The fact is that those that made the comments learned them somewhere and I am sure that some were from the parents.

I feel that it is totally appropriate that the kids should be disciplined by the school as a message needs to be sent home that we do not approve of this type of behavior. Maybe then one of the kids will question their parents beliefs and actions.

So what are you saying........do nothing and allow this type of behavior to continue? Or do you not care because the candidate was not one of your liking?

[Sotnos]

Not that I can really figure out what's the outrage here...some (mostly kids) think people who support McCain are racists? That's kinda silly and I can't say I ever thought of it that way, but are we really trying to equate it with actual racism?

I'm really wondering if McCain stickers are so rare on Sand Key that they're being targeted, I think not. :D

[Maverick9911]

According to David Plouffe, September drew 632,000 new donors.

Final tally for the month: $150 million :drool:

[Avery86]

Ok, WW, by your logic, I was a terribly raised child because in middle school I had a mouth on me. I could cuss up a storm with the best of them.

Was it a result of bad parenting? No. It was a result of me being an immature kid. My parents did a great job of raising me, and I think that can be accurately judged as I'm an adult now.

Parents don't and can't watch over their children 24/7. I guess they should just turn off the TV, the radio, not go to movies, and completely alienate them from society so they don't act like a fool!

Also, has anyone thought about the fact that this is a 12 year old girl making this claim? There's absolutely zero proof that this even happened, or what group of people were saying these things to her. But leave it to a sensationalist news outlet (which FOX 35 is) to show the big bad group of black kids in the video as they're talking about it.

[Sotnos]

Also, has anyone thought about the fact that this is a 12 year old girl making this claim? There's absolutely zero proof that this even happened, or what group of people were saying these things to her. But leave it to a sensationalist news outlet (which FOX 35 is) to show the big bad group of black kids in the video as they're talking about it.
The parents didn't go to the school with this, the student didn't bring it to a teacher's attention...they took it to a news outlet which would have an interest in running a story like this. Doesn't seem to me that they're trying to constructively do something to resolve the issue, if one exists.

And yes, the blurry shot of a "menacing gang" which looked like dark-skinned kids was a nice touch, real subtle. :rolleyes:

[WaiverWire]

So then why teach these kids about drug abuse and sex education? It doesn't matter, they are only 7th graders. Hey, when they are in kindergarten and those lower grades.......forget about teaching them to be kind to each other. Don't place them in time out for their actions instead let them hit each other and say bad things.......they are only kids. They are too young to know better. Lets wait until they are a little older, then we can tell them racism is bad. :thumb:


And Pete, the flag burnt on the car was not the issue, to me it was the KKK that was left on the car. But I guess in your all eyes it is OK as the owner of the car didn't share your views. :thumb:

But then I am starting to see that some of you see it one way if it effects you and your interests, but not the interest of others................WOW, just WOW. :thumb:

[RSchmitz]

Kids say stuff like that all the time. Pete is right, they are middle schoolers. Some of them still probably think girls have cooties.

[Avery86]

So then why teach these kids about drug abuse and sex education? It doesn't matter, they are only 7th graders. Hey, when they are in kindergarten and those lower grades.......forget about teaching them to be kind to each other. Don't place them in time out for their actions instead let them hit each other and say bad things.......they are only kids. They are too young to know better. Lets wait until they are a little older, then we can tell them racism is bad. :thumb:

You're bringing up a different issue, and one that isn't really relevant to what is being said.

What a teacher and a parent can teach a kid is not necessarily going to govern what they do outside of the aforementioned people's supervision.

I didn't cuss up a storm in the classroom, I did it on the bus, or walking in-between classes. You get what I'm saying? Kids will be kids when adults aren't around. You can't control that. You just hope that what you've taught them takes hold, but saying stupid things is ALWAYS going to be innate.

I'm not even really sure what you're getting at.

[Avery86]

By the way, Colin Powell has officially endorsed Obama.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7678788.stm

[WaiverWire]

"You're bringing up a different issue, and one that isn't really relevant to what is being said."


Nice deflection........typical.

They are the same. We are talking about teaching kids between right or wrong be it they learn from those they run with, parents, siblings, etc.

And if you do not think they are the same then just when do you try to "ask" one not to be racist? When do we attempt to install values in others that all are equal?


And yes, it was a nice endorsement for Obama. I have a ton of respect for Powell.

[Avery86]

How is that a deflection?

I'm still not convinced this even happened. People said stuff to me when I had a Kerry button on my backpack in college, but I didn't get all in a huff, and I was actually legally able to vote. A 12 year old pre-teen girl making stories up is not far-fetched, especially when her parents were the ones that brought the story to the media's attention first, and not even to the school (which knows nothing of the event).

[pete]

I think you are missing my point Pete

I don't think you have a point WaiverWire, because you're expressing outrage over the actions of a 12 year old.

[WaiverWire]

I don't think you have a point WaiverWire, because you're expressing outrage over the actions of a 12 year old.


Outrage? What did I type that was even close to outrage. I just typed an opinion. But once again you read what you wanted into mere words that show no emotions.......convienant.

Again you failed to even attempt to answer the question. "At what time do you feel that a child should be taught that racism is wrong?"



I suggest you read Florida Chapter 1003 PUBLIC K-12 EDUCATION - 1003.42 Required instruction which has been in effect since the 2004-2005 school year.



Also.... 1106 K-20 EDUCATION CODE Chapter 1006
SUPPORT FOR LEARNING also known as the Bully/Harassing Statute

You may see that the State of Florida does not agree with you and that in middle school one can be charged under Chapter 1006, and under Chapter 1003 schools teach kids as low as "K" about this subject.

Also my wife was a School Resource Officer at a middle school for over 6 years in the North Tampa Area. This is not uncommon and when you meet the parents you more often then not learn why the kids are the way they are. I can also say the same with my dealing with chids over my 31 plus years. sad, but true.......as anyone in the justice system where many kids get their ideas from........most will tell you the parents......we are much bigger role models than many think.

[pete]

Well Waiver, looks like Maverick and I were right. The Republican noise machine never fails to live down to expectations. Limbaugh claims Powell only endorsed because Obama is black.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/jonathanmartin/1008/Limbaugh_Where_are_the_inexperienced_white_liberal s_Powell_has_endorsed.html

Apparently Pat Buchanan went much further on MSNBC calling Powell a traitor to the GOP who was a charity case who only got promoted through the ranks because of his race.

The wingers are nothing if not predictable.

[WaiverWire]

That is sad Pete as Powell is a good man. He has the right to support who ever he wants.

And look who is saying this......Limbaugh and Buchanan....enough said.

I wish he had run as a republican or been the VP.


Let me also add to the above post about parents that I have had kids that I took home, told the parents what happened and after seeing the reactions of the parents and the punishment handed out, recommended to the SAO not to file charges as the parents administered far harsher punishment than a judge ever would and/or could.

[pete]

And look who is saying this......Limbaugh and Buchanan....enough said.

Unfortunately, there's a decent chunk of the population that would jump off the highest building if Limbaugh told them to.

I expect Colin Powell's name to be smeared violently by right wing talk radio tomorrow. It's going to be ugly.

[Hoek]

That's pretty hypocritical of Buchanan considering he's been leading the charge against neocon foreign policy within his own side the whole time.

[WaiverWire]

Powell did not help matters if this is a quote from him that is at TBO.com:


Powell said he was cognizant of the racial aspect of his endorsement, but said that was not the dominant factor in his decision. If it was, he said, he would have made the endorsement months ago.:duh:


Why even give then an inch by saying "was not the dominant factor in his decision". They can twist it to mean that it was a factor, though not major.

Give Limbaugh and/or Buchanan even a sniff of something like that an they are going to ride it all month long. Howeve even if Powell had said nothing as to why, they would had jumped on him as that is who they are.

[the_narrow_way]

Powell said he was cognizant of the racial aspect of his endorsement, but said that was not the dominant factor in his decision. If it was, he said, he would have made the endorsement months ago.
I saw the interview, and the way that is typed up, while close, is not exactly what he said. What he did say was that if race was going to be his deciding factor, then he would have chosen Obama months ago.

[WaiverWire]

I saw the interview, and the way that is typed up, while close, is not exactly what he said. What he did say was that if race was going to be his deciding factor, then he would have chosen Obama months ago.


Thank you as I did not think he would say something like that.

[Maverick9911]

Nice turnout at the rally today. Obama was introduced by Carl Crawford, Willie Aybar, Cliff Floyd, Fernando Perez, Jonny Gomes and David Price.

[RSchmitz]

Nice turnout at the rally today. Obama was introduced by Carl Crawford, Willie Aybar, Cliff Floyd, Fernando Perez, Jonny Gomes and David Price.

Why wasn't I there

[Avery86]

Why wasn't I there

He's in Orlando in about 15 minutes if you can make it. haha

[RSchmitz]

:doh:

[pete]

Obama was introduced by Carl Crawford

To heck with Colin Powell, Obama's got #13's endorsement.

CNN is reporting McCain is pulling out of Colorado. That can't possibly be true. If it is, then McCain has to pick off a Kerry state or get New Mexico or Iowa back in his column to win. Obama's lead in New Mexico is bigger than his lead in Colorado, and his lead in Iowa is over double digits.

If he's pulling out of Colorado, I tell you, this election is over.

[Maverick9911]

Damn, if I only relied on cable news I would've sworn McCain had a 30 point lead in each of Ohio, Pennsylvania, Colorado, Florida and Minnesota.

Even at 5pm the line for early voting was huge. The Obama campaign is doing great at getting this message out loud and clear. Just two weeks left...

[WaiverWire]

"Even at 5pm the line for early voting was huge. The Obama campaign is doing great at getting this message out loud and clear. Just two weeks left..."

Yes, the democrats have done a great job in getting the citizens registered. However I wonder if the long lines today were the result of the record number of registrations or the poor planning by the Hillsborough County Supervisor of Elections.

At the voting center on Bearss Ave they only had 4 machines that would print your ballot. Once you signed in they had to feed your information to this printer so a ballot tailored to the races you could vote in. From the time you stepped up to sign in the process was about 5 minutes.......and they only had 4 stations that could complete this task. The room was filled with about 30 voting stations, and most were empty due to the long wait to get your ballot. Once you got the ballot filling in the bubble ws very easy and the scanner that read the vote was very fast. In other words they have many of these printers and need to use them until the early vote ends as I saw many arrive and leave without voting.

My recommendation is to be ready to stand in line for at least an 1 1/2 hours, or better yet get an absentee ballot. Once you get it you can take it to an early voting site and place it directly into a box.

[pete]

Yes, the democrats have done a great job in getting the citizens registered. However I wonder if the long lines today were the result of the record number of registrations or the poor planning by the Hillsborough County Supervisor of Elections.

Is Buddy still the Supervisor of Elections?

[Maverick9911]

Yep. Running for re-election vs. Phyllis Busansky.

[pete]

I hope Busansky buries him.

[TexasBolt]

I hope Busansky buries him.

If you all have party-line voting in Florida, he's toast.

[RSchmitz]

Its over. The 150 million is being used to get others elected at this point. Or set himself up in 2012. Or create a landslide.

[Donnie D]

CNN is reporting McCain is pulling out of Colorado. That can't possibly be true.

In my opinion, McCain can't get to 270 without holding all of his current states, winning every toss up state, plus Virginia and Colorado.

If you look at their campaign schedule for the next few days, Palin is in Nevada and Ohio (2 toss up states) and McCain is in Pennsylvania. They must have some internal polling that says they have a chance in Pa, because the published polls show that one solid Obama.

[Bolthed]

I don't think it's over, in fact, I'm worried.

McCain has run the most shameful, divisive and least-substantive campaign I have ever seen. He and his dangerous mate are on the offensive - an all-out assault hell-bent on dividing this nation. Country first, my ass!

I listened to a Palin speech today and, like McCain, she says nothing of what their administration will do but lists of sweeping generalities that sound like a pipe-dream shopping list: "We're gonna fix the housing market ... and health care ... and we'll make college affordable!" Really? How exactly are YOU going to do that!?? With "experience ... and judgement ... and wisdom." Oh, thanks. And the rest is fear-mongering and labeling of Obama as a terrorist and now a socialist.

The problem I've got is two-fold: The right-leaning part of our nation eats this shit up like a KFC bowl, and the left-leaning part of our nation ... well, they typically don't vote in the kind of numbers that reflect their majority. Let's face it, are a bunch of people who notoriously don't come out to vote going to come out to vote? Yeah? Are you sure? REALLY SURE?? How about if they've got two more weeks of hearing people say that Obama is going to win and he's leading by 5-8 points in the polls and the maps of electoral votes shows ... blah, blah, blah.

I'm afraid that a lot of those folks will revert to their typical voter apathy, some thinking that this cat is in the bag. Meanwhile, McCain and Satan feed on the weak minded.

This could still go horribly, horribly wrong.

[the_narrow_way]

Oh man, Bolthed, you are so right.

I think the Obama camp needs to harp on not being complacent again. I want to see Biden go up there and bring down the house insisting that people make sure they get out and vote. I want to hear him telling everyone to not be discouraged by anything. That this is our best chance to turn a new leaf in this country.

[aapbolt]

Sorry, but I have been really busy this week and did not get to post back. thanks Sotnos for your nice comments and here is he answer to your questions: Yes, they test all ESE,SLD and Downs kids in elementary and middle schools and those scores are supposed to be on grade level and yes it is for funding purposes. although in some limited cases portfolios are used for those kids you cannot do that for every child. By the way 12-13 year old girls are not far behind the immature 12-13 yr. old boys. I am lucky--sort of-- I teach all seniors in high school--but they have an entirely different set of problems.
Jay: the trade schools in europe are tested diffeently than the college prep schools and those tests are not counted against ours. they only count college prep tests in certain classes also. thus you have 50-60% of european students being compared to our 100% because our 100% are all taking college prep stuff, even though not all of them should be in that program. You hve the right of it concerning the teaching of foreign languages, it must start in the younger grades where the mind is more flexible and can pick up different languages much easier, case in point..myself..I actually remember almost all the french I learned in 2nd grade but little of the Latin I learned in 9th grade.

funding for school systems should be developed in terms of serving the needs of the student populations, in particular those who are not going to go to college and require a different set of educational opportunities preparation for the real world. right now everyone thinks that all students will go to college, but that is not true and we need to revamp our educational institutions to reflect real world priorities for those who will not go to college. One reason we have so many dropouts is because school is failing them not the other way around. Further, we need more men teaching in the elementary and middle schools to provide a good, we hope, example to all those guys coming out of single homes and to make education more structured to the needs of young men. right now it is not because of the dominance of female teachers it is structured to the needs of female students who can sit and listen and are not very physically active in the classroom. that may raise some hairs with a few people but it is very much like the feminists stating that education was not structured for girls when in fact 98% of the elementary and middle school teachers are/where female and were/are a bit discriminatory towards little boys, especially active boys.

Pete: I think you are right this election is over. Colin Powell's endorsement ended it. by the way Bolthed, you should research election history; this has not been that dirty of an election, nor has the mud really been slung all that much...see the 1972 election or the 1796 election for some classic mudslinging.

[pete]

You worry too much, Bolthed. At this stage of the game, the question isn't whether Obama will win, the question is by how much.

Bottom line, when Obama even posts leads in polls in places like North Dakota and Indiana roughly two weeks before the election, the only conclusion that should be drawn is that McCain is totally boned.

[WaiverWire]

Bolthed listen to pete........it is over. It would take a major, and I mean major, mistake by Obama.

Good post aapbolt. Many moons ago when I went to high school you test and were placed into an honors, college prep or technical level of classes. Thanks for the info.

[pete]

See now, I'm agreeing with Waiver. NOW I'm scared. :D

[Bolthed]

I said worst campaing that I had ever seen personally. And maybe I worry too much. I just don't want to be disappointed, or worse, shocked.

[pete]

Let me put it another way, Bolthed. When you start flogging "socialism" or "the liberal femminist agenda," are you airing a message aimed toward the independents you need to win an election, or are you trying to stave off mass defections from your base to try and prevent a landslide?

They know the states that Obama wins in 2008 will be very hard to take back in 2012 when he has the power of incumbency. For instance, Kerry only won a single state that Bush had won in 2000, New Hampshire. It's really, really hard to win back a state from an incumbent once they already win it. So it's really important for the GOP to try to hold reliably red states like North Carolina, Indiana, and Nevada, because if they don't they'll be entering the 2012 election cycle down 2-3 touchdowns.

[pete]

Incidentally, whatever states Obama comes close in but doesn't win on election night you can bet are very good targets to turn blue in 2012. If you look at the 2004 election, with the power of incumbency Bush turned Iowa and New Mexico.

And, I think Arizona might be a prime target in 2012 once the native son goes off the ballot. If you look at the map, the entire Southwest is purple except Arizona because McCain is the GOP nominee. If Obama does win Colorado, Nevada, and New Mexico, I see no reason why Arizona wouldn't be top of the list in 2012. There's nothing all that demographically different about AZ.

[pete]

http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20081021/BLOG8101/810210249?Title=Democrats_hold_edge_in_early_votin g

Democrats are dominating in Florida in terms of early voting. Republicans have a big lead in terms of absentee ballots.

[Maverick9911]

I listened to a Palin speech today and, like McCain, she says nothing of what their administration will do but lists of sweeping generalities that sound like a pipe-dream shopping list: "We're gonna fix the housing market ... and health care ... and we'll make college affordable!"

It's like Bizarro Obama lately - take everything he says and just adopt it as if its your own idea. The newest McCain ad (the tv spots with the soft piano music better suited for a Lifetime special) I saw had the thing about college and its the first time I had ever heard him mention it.

I know it was the first day of early voting but man, Obama was hammering that home yesterday and you couldn't go two minutes without being handed a flier with maps and directions to any of the local early vote places. They were even offering shuttles to take voters anywhere they needed to go. I doubt its this intense in say, New York or Massachusetts but still, very encouraging.

And I goofed yesterday - Willy Aybar wasn't there; it was Edwin Jackson :(

I stopped by my parents' house today and sitting for me next to my Obama Superman shirt order was a pamphlet from a PAC about how Obama is a baby killer. My dad wasn't trying to start crap but he said not only did he get that but that he got an email that Barack is....the Antichrist! Old news yes but to him it was a new - he was an Antichrist smear mail virgin! He usually walks the tightrope to annoy me and then on election eve he gives me some dramatic speech about how he voted for the guy I wanted all along.

See now, I'm agreeing with Waiver. NOW I'm scared.

What I love is that my GOP friends will downplay or ignore polls, major political endorsements, even VP picks. Yet, the minute I told them Toby Keith is an Obama supporter, they all said the same thing: "oh crap, we're f'd".

[pete]

Yeah, that's a little known fact: Toby Keith is a registered Democrat.

[Maverick9911]

And not only him, uber-Republican Dennis Hopper says he's praying every day that Obama becomes president.

Strange times indeed.

[WaiverWire]

Incidentally, whatever states Obama comes close in but doesn't win on election night you can bet are very good targets to turn blue in 2012. If you look at the 2004 election, with the power of incumbency Bush turned Iowa and New Mexico.

And, I think Arizona might be a prime target in 2012 once the native son goes off the ballot. If you look at the map, the entire Southwest is purple except Arizona because McCain is the GOP nominee. If Obama does win Colorado, Nevada, and New Mexico, I see no reason why Arizona wouldn't be top of the list in 2012. There's nothing all that demographically different about AZ.

Like I have said before, what scares me is the fact that one party is going to have it all with no checks and no balances. However the nice thing about our election system is that they will have two years to put up or shut up. If Obama, Pelosi, Dodd, Franks and company can not turn it around by then you will see a shift again in the 2010 Congressional seats that will be up for grabs.

It only takes one election to turn over Congress thus returning a check and balance system.

[Sotnos]

What I love is that my GOP friends will downplay or ignore polls, major political endorsements, even VP picks. Yet, the minute I told them Toby Keith is an Obama supporter, they all said the same thing: "oh crap, we're f'd".
:pound: As Toby Keith goes, so goes the country. Who knew?

[Bolthed]

Once again reading fivethirtyeight.com makes me feel better, but Pete talking about 2012 already ... that still makes me nervous. It's textbook hubris, no? ;)

[Donnie D]

Who the hell is Toby Keith?

Anyway, Real Clear Politics has Obama with 251 "solid" votes. Those are states where he has a 10 point lead in the polls. The early voting should give you some comfort - the only question is whether the Obama voters will turn out. And so far they are in record numbers.

It's never over until it's over, but the fact that McCain is name calling shows how far behind he is. And just think we are only a couple of days from the last push as Rev. Wright finally makes his big appearance.

[the_narrow_way]

Like I have said before, what scares me is the fact that one party is going to have it all with no checks and no balances.
But what have we been getting by having these 'checks and balances'? Neither side can get anything done, because the other side puts their feet down and stops it. If one side controls the situation, then at least things should/will get done.

[WaiverWire]

But what have we been getting by having these 'checks and balances'? Neither side can get anything done, because the other side puts their put down and stops it. If one side controls the situation, then at least things should/will get done.


Then you vote out those that are unwilling to sit down and compromise.

One thing is for sure. This new control will have some major problems to fix. You think the market problem is a problem now? Just wait. If you do not follow the markets you should be. The markets control how the country and the world does. If you have a 401K, IRA, Money Market, etc you are part of the market. Financial advisor's have all been asking the same thing........."when do you want your money to come out." I have been in the market since 1981. Mine asked me 3 months ago. He wanted to make sure that I "checked out" at a lower tax rate. He was not concerned about the current market problems but the elections. Talk to anyone with an advisor and you hear the same thing.

If you think this is foolish and not happening just take the time to look at the volume of stocks being bought and sold daily. The numbers are low. Many are getting out and sitting on the sideline waiting to see what direction an Obama administration will go. So far we have heard from Pelosi and Franks who have said that they now want the upper 5% to pay off the debt. They want to raise corporate tax rates. Just over the past few days since Franks opened his mouth the market has once again fallen. Some will tell you the reporting numbers caused the market to fall. Not so, as we all knew the numbers would bad, but many came out good.....and still the market is going down.

And what happens when the market goes down? Jobs will be lost. Look no further than GM. My annalist says that if a majority get out of the markets due to the election, which is already happening, then companies like GM will not make it. Thousands in one city will be without a job.

I watched one adviser on TV say his client list is made up of 5%er's. He says none will pay taxes as he is moving their accounts offshore.

If you owned a company and your rent was $5000 a month for space at 15/Fowler and there was the same space at $1000 a month in the Westshore area...where would you go? With today's global economy companies can now go anywhere in the world....and many have. Why? Taxes and cheaper labor.

In short, we have to work together. You cut corporate taxes, companies stay, jobs are not lost or new ones are created. New jobs mean new tax dollars. Now if there is still a short fall then ask those that make the most to pay more. You also ask the government to spend less.

One thing is certain, Obama equals a turn down in the market which is going to effect everyone who has retirements tied to the market...........and this is almost everyone. The crisis in the market could had not happened at a worse time.........this election.

And watch Fannie and Freddie and look or listen for these three letters "DCI" during any hearings on the collapse of the markets.

[Bolthed]

No offense, but you say something smart and then you say something dumb.

First the dumb - "Obama equals a turn down in the market." Yeah, that sure happened the last time Democrats had control. I would HATE the economy and federal budget to revert back to those standards. :rolleyes:

Now the smart - "vote out those that are unwilling to sit down and compromise." Bravo. I agree. Everyone found to be corrupt, everyone found to be in bed with lobbyists, everyone found to put partisan political agendas ahead of the country's agenda, everyone who says stupid, divisive garbage about patriotism (I'm looking at you, Bachmann) ... throw all the bastards out!

[WaiverWire]

"First the dumb - "Obama equals a turn down in the market." Yeah, that sure happened the last time Democrats had control. I would HATE the economy and federal budget to revert back to those standards. "

None taken Bolthed.......quess you are not in the market. In the past your profits, also called gains, were taxed at 28%. Currently that rate is only 15%. Many say that because of this lower tax rate many turned to the markets and invested their 401k's, IRA's , etc. Most retirement plans are invested in the market and during the 15% tax rate have made record gains. In fact I do not know one that is not.

Obama says he will return to the 28% gains tax. Pelosi and Franks have said they want at least a 30% gains tax. This is why many are getting out, hoping to get out during a higher market before a dump of huge blocks mutual funds takes place, while being taxed at a lower rate. When that happens, the market will tumble and some major companies will not survive.

I was warned about this earlier this year by a very large financial planning company. Several months later I moved to another company. From day one I have been hearing the same thing. I know of no one who's financial planner has said different. And many of my friends have made plans to get out at a certain DOW number.

[Flycoon]

Palin family's clothing allowance. http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/alltherage/2008/10/palins-economic.html. Seems a regular old hockey Mom would be just fine and dandy with a few oufits from JCP.

[WaiverWire]

And how about her writing off her kids travel :doh:


I thought it was bad that Chrysler and GM were talking in oder to get together. Now it is being reported that Chrysler is looking to sell itself off to other companies. Having been raised in the auto industry in the Detroit area I feel very sorry for these employed in a very hard hit area. Seems things can only get worse for Michigan.



http://customwire.ap.org/dynamic/stories/C/CHRYSLER?SITE=FLPET&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2008-10-22-09-46-25

[Flycoon]

And how about her writing off her kids travel :doh:


That was a $21K 5 day trip to NYC (Unamerican) for a 5 hour meeting paid by the state. Plain old every day hockey Mom, you betcha.

[pete]

but Pete talking about 2012 already ... that still makes me nervous. It's textbook hubris, no?

It would be if David Axlerod was saying it. I'm just some schmoe on a message board, though.

Regarding the economy, I'll say what my dad (union man) was told by his dad and handed down to me:

You want to work? Vote for a Democrat. You want to starve? Vote for a Republican.

[Sotnos]

And how about her writing off her kids travel :doh:
The Head of Finance of Saftey Harbor just got canned for charging $12k worth of her kid's travel expenses on her city card...seems to me Palin maybe shouldn't have a job to go back to if/when her ticket loses. I think you should get charged with theft for such a blatant misuse of taxpayer money, personally.

[WaiverWire]

The Head of Finance of Saftey Harbor just got canned for charging $12k worth of her kid's travel expenses on her city card...seems to me Palin maybe shouldn't have a job to go back to if/when her ticket loses. I think you should get charged with theft for such a blatant misuse of taxpayer money, personally.

Difference is she is the head person. Who is going to can her.

wonder if it is too late to bring in Romney :bigcry:

[Maverick9911]

Please tell me I did not just see an ad with people saying "I'M Joe the plumber".

What a pathetic campaign.

[pete]

Please tell me I did not just see an ad with people saying "I'M Joe the plumber".

"I do unlicensed subcontracting!"

[Sotnos]

Difference is she is the head person. Who is going to can her.Fine. She should be impeached, but from what I've heard it's expected for Alaska politicians to be corrupt so this is probably small potatoes to those people.

[WaiverWire]

Fine. She should be impeached, but from what I've heard it's expected for Alaska politicians to be corrupt so this is probably small potatoes to those people.

I didn't know they were Democrats up there in Alaska :D

[WaiverWire]

"You need to know that Barack Obama opposes mandatory prison sentences for sex offenders, drug dealers, and murderers," Giuliani says in the call. "It's true, I read Obama's words myself. And recently, congressional liberals introduced a bill to eliminate mandatory prison sentences for violent criminals — trying to give liberal judges the power to decide whether criminals are sent to jail or set free."..............................Rudy Giuliani


Obama campaign has not issued a comment but his web site does say "the Illinois senator does support "reforming mandatory minimum prison sentences."

[Hoek]

Well as long as we continue to think locking up every pot smoker is going to do any good there has to be room made for them somehow..

[WaiverWire]

I wonder if his comment was about the Federal System or is someone trying to tell the States how to handle their own court systems? He has to be referring to the Feds, just has to.

[Maverick9911]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VHB6APpaH5k

[WaiverWire]

Dr. Adam Lerrick, a professor of economics at Carnegie Mellon University, has reviewed the Obama tax plan and has told the Wall Street Journal that in order for his economic plan to work Obama will have to lower his tax ceiling from $250,000 to $75,000. Dr. Lerrick also has stated that Obama has been misleading when it comes to him saying that he is not raising taxes on those in the lower tax brackets when in fact he claims Obama has said that he is going to let Bush's tax plan expire or possibly attempt to revoke it saying it favors those in higher tax brackets. He claims that there are several tax breaks fro lower income families that will be eliminated and thus everyone will see an across the board tax increase.

Want to know the background of Dr. Lerrick..........http://www.aei.org/scholars/scholarID.98,filter.all/scholar.asp

Obama and the Tax Tipping Point:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122463231048556587.html

[Maverick9911]

Odd that nowhere on either link do they mention that Dr. Lerrick is one of the McCain campaign's official economic policy advisors. I'd think the WSJ would at least disclose that.

[WaiverWire]

Could you post a link to that Mav as I have not been able to find one. I did see that he has writen some articles about McCains plans.

The guy is very good at what he does. These are some of what he has done:


Consulting:
Advisor to the Joint Economic Committee of the U.S. Congress
Advisor to the Majority Leader of the House of Representatives of the U.S. Congress, 2001-2003
Senior Advisor to the Chairman of the International Financial Institution Advisory Commission of the U.S. government

Other Professional Activities:
Head of International Product Development, Salomon Brothers (1984-87)
Head of Product Development, Credit Suisse First Boston (1987-89)
Visiting Scholar, American Enterprise Institute
Economics Advisory Council, Princeton University



Sometimes it is good to listen to all sides. Thus you will have more information and be more knowledgeable.

I have read both sides on issues. Some are good and some are bad. One thing is for sure neither side has all the answers and one side is not wrong 100% as some here would like for you to believe.

This is the first time I heard that taxes would be going up for everyone once the Bush tax cuts sunset. I research and sure enough it is true. Funny how no one has touched on it until now.

[Maverick9911]

So what. The guy is very good at what he does.

Sometimes it is good to listen to all sides. Thus you will have more information and be more knowledgeable.

No, it's good to listen to all sides all of the time. Just because I made my choice months ago instead of wavering doesn't mean I didn't then and don't now.

And if the GOP is going to raise eyebrows whenever Ben Bernanke or Warren Buffet support Obama's plans (since both endorsed him), I think the very least the article could do is mention that this guy is on the McCain staff. Doesn't make him right or wrong but we should know. (Or maybe that's the old journalist in me relying on full disclosure, which is probably why I flamed out of the business).

The more information we have the better. :thumb:

[WaiverWire]

I found a link that said he was one of about 30 economic advisors back in July of 2007. Nothing saying he is still there.

Glad to hear you read everything as I have. I have found good points and trash on both sides.

[Maverick9911]

Michelle Bachmann, is the RNCC un-American also?

The national fundraising committee for GOP congressional candidates has canceled its Twin Cities TV advertising for Rep. Michele Bachmann, who is using the flap over her comments about Barack Obama to raise money on her own.

The National Republican Congressional Committee pulled ads scheduled to begin running Monday through Election Day. At just KSTP television, the canceled ads would have cost $50,000 from Oct. 27 through Nov. 4.

A Republican source confirmed Wednesday that the NRCC is pulling its funding out of the Sixth District race.

[pete]

McCain is broke.

At McCain's spending rate of $1.5 million a day, the Arizona senator likely has only $12 million to spend in the next 11 days before the Nov. 4 election.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/campaign_money

[Maverick9911]

But McCain's Oct. 1-15 filing showed that the campaign paid $22,800 to Palin's traveling stylist, Amy Strozzi, an acclaimed celebrity makeup artist. In contrast, McCain's foreign policy adviser, Randy Scheunemann, was paid $12,500, the report showed.

Christ, think of how many terrorist/baby killer/arugula eater mailers that or the $150k for Palin's duds would've bought.

[pete]

Michelle Bachmann, is the RNCC un-American also?

Bachmann is now down 47%-44% according to SUSA.

I'm pleasantly surprised to find that, unlike 2004, there does seem to be a limit to the batspit crazy bull(expletive) voters are willing to listen to from the candidates.

Memo to GOP: Instead of trying to call people terrorists, socialists, communists, liberal feminists, anti-American, etc etc, try addressing the issues that effect people's day-to-day lives instead. You might just manage to avoid getting your asses kicked next time if you do.

This election smells more and more like a major realignment a la 1980 or even 1932 every day.

[Maverick9911]

Guess Mr. Smith is relegated to wishful thinking since his error filled report about Sarah Palin's 60,000 plus rally in Clearwater.

Five reasons not to write off John McCain's candidacy

By Adam C. Smith, Times Political Editor
In print: Thursday, October 23, 2008

Campaign 2008

Look at the electoral map with less than two weeks to go, and the picture could hardly look more grim for Sen. John McCain. He's playing defense in a host of states he can't afford to lose — from Florida to Virginia to Indiana — and polls show his options dwindling fast for capturing enough states to reach the necessary 270 electoral votes. But 12 days is still a lot of time, and so far almost nothing about this election has been predictable.

1. The primaries told us something. If there's one thing we learned from those hard-fought party battles, it's that McCain closes strong and Obama doesn't. McCain capitalized on momentum from some early wins to take control of the race by mid February, but Obama followed primary wins with losses and didn't claim the nomination until June. Now, a number of state and national polls show a tightening race.

2. Polls aren't gospel. Question marks on polling this year: hidden racism; the increasing number of Americans refusing to talk to pollsters; the growing number of voters not getting polled because they use only cell phones; how polling models factor in infrequent voters who may not show up on Election Day. On Wednesday, a national Associated Press poll had Obama up by one point, while a Fox News poll had him up nine.

3. Complacency. Obama is relying heavily on big turnout by young voters and other groups who typically don't vote in large numbers. The more that conventional wisdom coalesces around the idea that Obama will win, the less motivated many Obama voters will be to turn out. Hence Obama's mantra lately is to remind supporters about Hillary Rodham Clinton's big upset: "Remember New Hampshire."

4. Pennsylvania. Polls show Obama with a double digit lead in the Keystone State, but the McCain campaign insists Obama is underperforming in key Democratic parts of Pennsylvania and they could eke out a victory. If McCain wins those 21 electoral votes, that could put him in the White House.

5. Obama hasn't closed the sale. Despite his vast advantages in TV and organizational spending in battleground states, many polls show he has not crossed the threshold of 50 percent support. There's every reason to think last-minute deciders could break McCain's way.

To even compare the two primaries is laughable. "Many" polls? McCain can barely break 44, let alone 50. The AP poll had a demographic that was like 45 percent "born again Christians" and the youth vote sided for McCain near the 70 percent range apparently. Yeah, that's legitimate.

[Maverick9911]

http://www.clearspring.com/widgets/4727a250e66f9723?p=490134029d191ad3&flv=logoLink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww%252Enbc%252E com%253Fvty%2520%25602%2520fromWidget%255FVideo%26 clipID%3D783981%26siteDomain%3Dnbc%26graboffUrl%3D http%253A%252F%252Fvideo%252Enbcuni%252Ecom%252Fwi dgetxml%252FsingleClip1%252Fnbcshare%252Epng%26sit eShow%3Dnbc%252Ecom%26moreLikeLink%3Dhttp%253A%252 F%252Fdev%252Enbc%252Ecom%252FSaturday%255FNight%2 55FLive%252Fvideo%252Fclips%252Fupdate%252Dthursda y%252Dbush%252Dendorsement%252F783981%252F%26textF ieldColor%3DFFFFFF%26videoPlayerSkin%3Dhttp%253A%2 52F%252Fvideo%252Enbcuni%252Ecom%252Fwidgetxml%252 FsingleClip1%252Fskin14%252Eswf%26showID%3D61%26om niture%3DNBC%252Cprod%26bgndUrl%3Dhttp%253A%252F%2 52Fvideo%252Enbcuni%252Ecom%252Fwidgetxml%252Fsing leClip1%252Fbg%252Eswf%26configID%3D1105%26configx mlPath%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fvideo%252Enbcuni%252Ec om%252Fwidgetxml%252FsingleClip1%252Fsingleclip%25 5FomniConfig%252Exml%26wName%3DNBC%2520Video%26vid eo%5Ftitle%3DSaturday%2520Night%2520Live%2520%252D %2520Update%2520Thursday%253A%2520Bush%2520Endorse ment%26video%5Fimgurl%3Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fv ideo%25252Enbc%25252Ecom%25252Fplayer%25252Fmezzan ine%25252Fimage%25252Ephp%25253Fw%25253D350%252526 h%25253D196%252526path%25253Dnbc2%25252F2cde568203 2c0421001c2da21944138d%25255Fmezzn%25252Ejpg%25252 6hash%25253D1467ecb80b049c2baf8282c961bc2714%26vid eo%5Furl%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fdev%252Enbc%252Ecom% 252FSaturday%255FNight%255FLive%252Fvideo%252Fclip s%252Fupdate%252Dthursday%252Dbush%252Dendorsement %252F783981%252F%26video%5Fdescription%3DPres%252E %2520Bush%2520endorses%2520McCain%2520and%2520Pali n

Nice to see Will step in as Dubya once again. Reports are Obama will be on the final show before election day.

[Sotnos]

Michelle Bachmann, is the RNCC un-American also?GOOD, glad they're smart enough to back off of her, scary scary woman.

[Maverick9911]

Another epic fail. Regarding the poor McCain campaign worker who was assaulted for her bumper sticker, beaten while a backwards B was carved into her face...

John Moody, executive vice president at Fox News, has commented on his blog that "this incident could become a watershed event in the 11 days before the election. If Ms. Todd's allegations are proven accurate, some voters may revisit their support for Senator Obama, not because they are racists (with due respect to Rep. John Murtha), but because they suddenly feel they do not know enough about the Democratic nominee.

"If the incident turns out to be a hoax, Senator McCain's quest for the presidency is over, forever linked to race-baiting."

D'OH

Police sources tell KDKA that a campaign worker has now confessed to making up a story that a mugger attacked her and cut the letter "B" in her face after seeing her McCain bumper sticker.

Ashley Todd, 20, of Texas, initially told police that she was robbed at an ATM in Bloomfield and that the suspect became enraged and started beating her after seeing her GOP sticker on her car.

Police investigating the alleged attack, however, began to notice some inconsistencies in her story and administered a polygraph test.

http://kdka.com/local/attack.McCain.Bloomfield.2.847628.html

Next time, Ashley, don't pull a Morton Downey and carve it in backwards.

[pete]

:nono:

When are these knuckledraggers going to realize there's no such thing as "Obama reverse-racism?"

[RSchmitz]

What's reverse racism?

[pete]

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/239703.php

One of McCain's own advisors, and former Solicitor General under Ronald Reagan, has asked to be removed from the McCain campaign's list of supporters and says he has voted by absentee ballot for Obama because of his concern over Sarah Palin.

Cold blooded.

[Maverick9911]

It's because he's black. Like Scott McClellan.

[pete]

And former Republican Governor William Weld of Massachussetts, who also endorsed Obama today.

Drip. Drip. Drip. Obama's people aren't dumb. They're going to keep rolling out these Obamacan endorsements one a day until election day.

[Maverick9911]

http://www.bobcesca.com/images/attack.jpg
:hysterical:

[Maverick9911]

I hate to keep giving this more attention but this is getting ridiculous, even for the election season.

http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/10/mccain_aide_gave_reporters_inc.php

John Verrilli, the news director for KDKA in Pittsburgh, told TPM Election Central that McCain's Pennsylvania campaign communications director gave one of his reporters a detailed version of the attack that included a claim that the alleged attacker said, "You're with the McCain campaign? I'm going to teach you a lesson."

Verrilli also told TPM that the McCain spokesperson had claimed that the "B" stood for Barack. According to Verrilli, the spokesperson also told KDKA that Sarah Palin had called the victim of the alleged attack, who has since admitted the story was a hoax.

The McCain spokesperson's claims -- which came in the midst of extraordinary and heated conversations late yesterday between the McCain campaign, local TV stations, and the Obama camp, as the early version of the story rocketed around the political world -- is significant because it reveals a McCain official pushing a version of the story that was far more explosive than the available or confirmed facts permitted at the time.


Facts First.

[Hoek]

Figured you guys would dig this article after all the Ayers crap..

Friends in Low Places: It's time for John McCain to come clean about his own radical friends (http://reason.com/news/show/129615.html)

McCain has attacked Barack Obama for his connection to former Weather Underground member William Ayers, who in his words "was unrepentant over his activities as a member of a terrorist organization." In the final debate, McCain said that "we need to know the full extent of that relationship."

But though he thinks it's terrible for Obama to associate with dangerous militants, he thinks it's fine for him to do the same thing. And he'd rather go back to the Hanoi Hilton than disclose "the full extent of that relationship."

The extremist McCain has befriended is Gordon Liddy, who got a 20-year prison sentence for multiple felonies in the Watergate scandal—including burglary, conspiracy, and illegal wiretapping. Finally forced to acknowledge the connection in an interview last week by David Letterman, McCain ducked and dodged before replying, "He went to prison, he paid his debt, as people do. I'm not in any way embarrassed to know Gordon Liddy."

[pete]

He also once met with Pinochet. Talk about "palling around" with the wrong people.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-dinges/mccain-meets-a-bloody-dic_b_137422.html

[Donnie D]

Palin drops the puck in St. Louis. OOPS.


"Palin's appearance might have been costly to the Blues as goalie Manny Legace left the game after one period with an injury that possibly occurred when he tripped over the carpet placed on the ice for Palin and her family to walk on.

Just before the ceremony, Legace was the first player onto the ice for St. Louis. A team official pointed to the carpet, but as Legace stepped onto it with his skate, he fell, then gingerly made his way to the crease."

[pete]

The woman is a menace to anyone she comes into contact with. Democrats. Republicans. Canadian citizens. Wolves.

[Hoek]

Okay now I really hate her for indirectly injuring one of my fantasy team's goalies.

Seriously though, I don't care who it is, but why the hell are sports teams allowing campaigning to intersect with their affairs? I go to a hockey game to escape all that crap.

[RSchmitz]

As long as all they are doing is dropping the puck, or throwing out the first pitch, I'm fine with it.

[jaydeedub]

The woman is a menace to anyone she comes into contact with. Democrats. Republicans. Canadian citizens. Wolves.

Which I'm hoping my guess comes true that she'll just fade away once Obama's ticket wins. She had her 15 minutes of fame for waaaaay too long.

[pete]

One of the national polls recently asked who Republicans would like to see be their nominee in 2012. She finished third to Romney and Huckabee. That tells me she's damaged goods and she's done.

I still think the Republicans will go off the board and nominate someone more unknown like Sonny Purdue in 2012.

[pete]

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/14921.html

Obama is now up to 44% among white voters and holds a 15% lead among white Catholics. If that's even remotely true, he'll win in a landslide. He's already probably going to win Hispanics by about a 65-35 split and African Americans by 95-5.

And if he really wins white Catholics by that much, he'll blow McCain out in the Midwest. It's not possible for a Republican to win Pennsylvania or even Ohio if they're getting blown out like that in that demographic.

[Maverick9911]

Seriously though, I don't care who it is, but why the hell are sports teams allowing campaigning to intersect with their affairs? I go to a hockey game to escape all that crap.

Ok not that it matters to voters but has anyone ever heard her mention anything about the game other than being a self-described "hockey mom"? She's using that to campaign and go drop pucks in St. Louis and Philly and supporters are saying she would be great for the game but has she ever demonstrated even a simple knowledge of the game? I know it's not important but im just curious. I could go around calling myself a NASCAR dude all day but I know jack about the sport other than the fact Tony Stewart is insane and for some reason everyone hates Jeff Gordon.

[Hoek]

Yeah I don't get that either. It seems to be the only reason why teams are going along with it, but IMO you have to throw more of a bone (must.. avoid.. adding an "r".. oops) to the NHL than that for the sham to be worth it. Anyone have any links to stories of her actually talking about hockey? Too lazy to look up local papers..

Then again most soccer moms know absolutely nothing about soccer either. It's just about the fact that they shuttle their kids off to some extracurricular to fill out their resume or keep them physically busy. :p

What's not to hate about Jeff Gordon? He wins a lot (maybe not any more but still). He's handsome. And he drives rainbow colored and flaming cars. Hmm.. Personally a bigger fan of open wheel racing myself.

Edit: Looks like she's into the pugilism at least.. Source (http://sports.yahoo.com/fantasy/blog/roto_arcade/post/Killing-fantasy-teams-one-battleground-state-at;_ylt=ArUwJvCGcIXsxeIQlvKTBPZ7vLYF?urn=fantasy,1 17307)

Palin watched the fight enthusiastically, clapping as the fight got more intense. By the time referees separated the combatants, Palin was waving an oversized foam Blues finger.

[pete]

(CNN) -- With 10 days until Election Day, long-brewing tensions between GOP vice presidential candidate Gov. Sarah Palin and key aides to Sen. John McCain have become so intense, they are spilling out in public, sources say.

Several McCain advisers have suggested to CNN that they have become increasingly frustrated with what one aide described as Palin "going rogue."...

A second McCain source says she appears to be looking out for herself more than the McCain campaign.

"She is a diva. She takes no advice from anyone," said this McCain adviser. "She does not have any relationships of trust with any of us, her family or anyone else.

"Also, she is playing for her own future and sees herself as the next leader of the party. Remember: Divas trust only unto themselves, as they see themselves as the beginning and end of all wisdom."


http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/25/palin.tension/index.html

Dumbest. VP. Selection. Ever. Period.

[pete]

This woman, who is a new anchor for an Orlando TV station, should be fired. Point blank. That was the most biased, hatchet job of an interview I think I've ever seen in my life. Seriously. She should be gone. Asking if someone is a Marxist? Total bullcrap. I give Biden a lot of credit for not going ape on her, as that was clearly her goal.

jxT0ELP7az0

Is it now fair game to ask Sarah Palin if she's a Christian fundamentalist who believes in end of days prophecy, or John McCain if he's a bomb happy imperialist? The funny thing is, they're a lot closer to those things than Barack Obama and Joe Biden are to being Marxists, and you can bank on that.

There's nothing good about people like this anchor or that campaign worker from Pennsylvania who lied about being attacked. These are people who spread hate and fear to try to divide this country for their own small-minded narrow goals, and they should be ashamed of themselves. They aren't fit to call themselves Americans.

[Hoek]

_Y6_s3O5Bj0

Way to help with the "family political project" there, Joe! :p

[pete]

ANCHORAGE, Alaska – Gov. Sarah Palin's signature accomplishment — a contract to build a 1,715-mile pipeline to bring natural gas from Alaska to the Lower 48 — emerged from a flawed bidding process that narrowed the field to a company with ties to her administration, an Associated Press investigation shows.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081026/ap_on_el_pr/palin_pipeline;_ylt=AkZT27WUP5X1psyzptKP2M134T0D

She's just the gift that keeps giving.

[astro]

This woman, who is a new anchor for an Orlando TV station, should be fired. Point blank. That was the most biased, hatchet job of an interview I think I've ever seen in my life. Seriously. She should be gone. Asking if someone is a Marxist? Total bullcrap. I give Biden a lot of credit for not going ape on her, as that was clearly her goal.

jxT0ELP7az0

Is it now fair game to ask Sarah Palin if she's a Christian fundamentalist who believes in end of days prophecy, or John McCain if he's a bomb happy imperialist? The funny thing is, they're a lot closer to those things than Barack Obama and Joe Biden are to being Marxists, and you can bank on that.

There's nothing good about people like this anchor or that campaign worker from Pennsylvania who lied about being attacked. These are people who spread hate and fear to try to divide this country for their own small-minded narrow goals, and they should be ashamed of themselves. They aren't fit to call themselves Americans.

OH SHIT! I already casted my vote for Obama. We are doomed, doomed!

[Sotnos]

This woman, who is a new anchor for an Orlando TV station, should be fired. Point blank. That was the most biased, hatchet job of an interview I think I've ever seen in my life. Seriously. She should be gone. Asking if someone is a Marxist? Total bullcrap. I give Biden a lot of credit for not going ape on her, as that was clearly her goal.
:tsk: WTF was that?! Never seen such biased garbage passed off as an interview in my life outside of O'Reilly. Sad part is, look at all the iterations of it on youtube: "Best Interview EVAH! Biden gets smackdown! Real reporter asking REAL questions". It obviously played well to the troops, Orlando is a perfect place for her.

[Flycoon]

I wish the cable news networks would simply record Pappy and his pit bull's stump speeches and show us the 30 seconds that are different than broadcasting the entire thing. Like watching the Flintstones over and over and over...

[TexasBolt]

I wish the cable news networks would simply record Pappy and his pit bull's stump speeches and show us the 30 seconds that are different than broadcasting the entire thing. Like watching the Flintstones over and over and over...

They've got 24 hours to kill every day. If they limited themselves to only talking about real, important things, they'd only have about two hours of programming a day.

[Avery86]

:tsk: WTF was that?! Never seen such biased garbage passed off as an interview in my life outside of O'Reilly. Sad part is, look at all the iterations of it on youtube: "Best Interview EVAH! Biden gets smackdown! Real reporter asking REAL questions". It obviously played well to the troops, Orlando is a perfect place for her.

I can't stand living here anymore. Can't wait to move (two months away).

[Maverick9911]

I wish the cable news networks would simply record Pappy and his pit bull's stump speeches and show us the 30 seconds that are different than broadcasting the entire thing.


It'd be unfair to Pappy to show anything less. I mean, they're already doing their jobs by commenting on how excited his "massive" crowds are (less than 4,000 in New Mexico, while on the same day in the same city Obama had, oh, 45,000). Obama's 100,000+ rally in Denver...blah, just "a couple thousand" folks.

Should Obama win this thing, I think I'm going to spend most of Nov. 5th scouring blogs and YouTube to catch the various reactions from the cable news media. Tom Brokaw, Wolf Blitzer, Lou Dobbs, Scarborough and his cackling tart Mika, David Gregory etc....I want to see all their heads melt and explode, Raiders style .

If this election season hasn't exposed the slow depressing death of journalism it's at least killed the notion that it is entirely liberal in tone.

[Donnie D]

I'm sure the conservatives would agree with you that Brokow, Blitzer and Gregory are biased - but in the other direction.

Tough to be in the middle. Kind of like sport's announcers, everyone thinks they are biased against the home team. (Read the comments on this blog about Fox sports and the Rays.)

The cable news networks can't run Countdown and Maddow all night. Oh, wait a minute, MSNBC does exactly that.

[RSchmitz]

wow

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TW_wQgWviZ8&eurl=http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/10/26/133722/20/1016/642755

[pete]

Blitzer's secretly a GOP schill. He'll work for Fox News before it's all over Brokaw and Gregory are closer to calling it down the middle.

All the left has is Olbermann and Maddow. That's it. That and fake news on Comedy Central. That's all we got.

[Maverick9911]

Pete, what is this mess about massive voter purging in Georgia (one account said 50k, another said twice as many)? earlier this month?

Ed Rendell is worried about this in his own state as well.

[pete]

That's why Secretary of State elections are more important than you think.

[pete]

Senator Ted Stevens found guilty of being a corrupt old dirtbag.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081027/ap_on_re_us/stevens_trial_17/print;_ylt=Ah2MNMhod3gBZwgnJciI5yLLLJ94

Love those Alaska Republicans.

What does it mean?

Senator Mark Begich (D-AK)

[kid A]

That's why Secretary of State elections are more important than you think.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/35/Katherine_Harris.jpg

case in point.

[pete]

The SOS in Florida is appointed, but yeah, case in point.

Kenneth Blackwell in Ohio in 2004 is another prototypical example.

That's why I asked about Buddy being the head of elections in Hillsborough. Who counts the votes does matter. Heck, even the order in which candidates are listed on the ballot matters. It's the magic of statistics.

[Sotnos]

Heck, even the order in which candidates are listed on the ballot matters.Been wondering since I got my ballot how they determine that.

[pete]

I forget if that's determined on the state or county level. County I think.

Studies have shown the candidate on the top line of the ballot tends to perform as much as 3% better.

[Maverick9911]

McCain was first on my ballot :tsk:

[Sotnos]

Yeah, all the Repubs were first on the Pasco ballot.

I guess Biden was up in NPR tonight, one of my friends got to be in the group on the stage, she was psyched to say the least. :) If anyone finds any clips please let me know!

[Maverick9911]

Biden's gonna be all over FL this week. Melbourne and Ocala tomorrow and Jupiter the next day.

They usually post the road clips here...I'll keep an eye out for anything else about this particular rally.

http://my.barackobama.com/page/content/hqblog

[kid A]

The SOS in Florida is elected, but yeah, case in point.


Heh, actually, when I first posted that about Harris, I just assumed the position was an elected one (I just wanted to get a dig in at her anyways...;)). It is now a position appointed by the gov per a 1998 constitutional amendment. But...she was the last _elected_ SOS for Fla.

[pete]

Yeah, I meant appointed.

[pete]

McCain may have Joe the Plumber, but Obama has Al the Shoe Salesman!

99HzP6BQm5Y

[Maverick9911]

LOL

I'd rather trust the Polk High legend who scored four touchdowns in a single game any day.

[Donnie D]

Harris was elected. The position became an appointed position while she was in office.

If I remember correctly, ballot position in Florida is based upon the number of registered voters per party in each county.

[Sotnos]

Story on Biden in Pasco (http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/article877001.ece)

Pasco County Republican Chairman Bill Bunting wore a navy T-shirt with a picture of GOP vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin shooting a gun.

The slogan: Bring It On.

"This is a shirt that represents America," he said.:ohwell:

[Avery86]

LOL.

Ohhh .. people in this country. And people don't understand why so many other people in the world view us as gun-toting, Bible-thumping goofballs.

[Maverick9911]

It's funny but at the same time it scares the hell out of me. You see stories like the one about the 102 person killing spree to be finished by an Obama assassination and it is sickening. Some nutjob being egged on by these hate rallies is going to be pushed over the edge after next week and think its their patriotic duty to the United States to go knock him off.

[Sotnos]

I was just handed a copy of an executive order from Crist extending early voting at all locations from 7 am - 7 pm through October 31st and having 12 hours of voting this weekend. Looking it up just now, most of the places in Hillsborough & Pasco were only open 10-6. Let's not get into the situation in Pinellas, we get calls all day long about it. :rolleyes:

[Bolthed]

It's funny but at the same time it scares the hell out of me. You see stories like the one about the 102 person killing spree to be finished by an Obama assassination and it is sickening. Some nutjob being egged on by these hate rallies is going to be pushed over the edge after next week and think its their patriotic duty to the United States to go knock him off.

If there are two Americas, there is definitely a "Crazy" America. I hear people embrace Palin and it chills me to the bone. She stands for knowing and saying nothing as a virtue. It's ridiculous.

[Flycoon]

This mega-endorsement should push Pappy over the top. http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/28/joe-plumber-backs-claim-obama-bring-death-israel/

Talk about desperate...

[Sotnos]

God help us if anyone cares what that guy has to say about anything. I guess he spent the time he should've spent filling out his 1040 studying the situation in the Middle East. :rolleyes:

[Maverick9911]

Ed O'Neill will kick Wurzelbacher's ass any day of the week.

[pete]

The RSCC actually had the balls to send a direct mail hit piece to me about Jim Martin the very same day I got back my third thank you postcard from the Martin campaign. Memo to RSCC: if you honestly think sending me a mailer attacking Jim Martin as "librul" with big scary pictures of Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi is really going to work, then your microtargeting sucks.

[Bolthed]

God help us if anyone cares what that guy has to say about anything. I guess he spent the time he should've spent filling out his 1040 studying the situation in the Middle East. :rolleyes:

Same people who are in love with Palin as a "legitimate" national politician. The idea that "Joe the Plumber," some dude who asked a candidate a question and then - surprise! - had opinions, should actually run for office ... it's laughable. It's disgraceful. It shows how incredibly stupid some people are in this country.

My god. :tsk:

[the_narrow_way]

I find it extremely sad that the McCain camp is repeatedly saying that Obama 'didn't like' Joe the Plumber's question. Anyone who either read the transcript or saw the video of the event can plainly see that if anyone didn't enjoy it, it was Joe. Obama wouldn't let the guy go, and went on for minutes. I'm afraid the only way you can believe that Obama 'didn't like' the question is if you're a blind McCain loyalist or you just haven't seen or read about the event first-hand.

[RSchmitz]

Anybody see the anti-Kay Hagan ad?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5AsdYWtKLY

[Donnie D]

McCain sticks hoof in mouth yet again:

According to the AP:

McCain and Palin called Rashid Khalidi a former spokesman for the Palestinian Liberation Organization, a characterization that Khalidi has denied in the past. Both candidates said guests at the party made critical comments about Israel.

Khalidi is a professor of Middle East Studies at Columbia University and a longtime friend of Obama's. Khalidi has publicly criticized Israel, but he and Obama have both said they hold very different opinions on Israeli issues.

McCain also has ties to Khalidi through a group that Khalidi helped found 15 years ago. The Center for Palestine Research and Studies has received more than $800,000 from an organization that McCain chairs.

Does that mean McCain financially supports terrorists?

[Maverick9911]

McCain was only lulling him into a false sense of security, stuffing his pockets before throttling him with his bare hands to defend America from the terrorist scum. God, what a maverick.

McCain Fever - Catch It!

[Sotnos]

Anybody see the anti-Kay Hagan ad?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5AsdYWtKLY
I'd seen a much shorter version of that. That sucker seems way too long to possibly air, geez. I don't agree with those people at all, but are they any more scary than evangelicals who'd be happy to turn this country into a theocracy & force us all to practice religion THEIR way?

That was quite a smear attempt I must say, Dole must be nervous.

[Maverick9911]

I don't agree with those people at all, but are they any more scary than evangelicals who'd be happy to turn this country into a theocracy & force us all to practice religion THEIR way?

I got a video today featuring some rambling guy ranting about the greatness of trickle down economics and how "Obama socialism" will fail, how the Democrats intentionally keep the people poor so they can keep their identity as defenders of the poor (wtf?), etc. No facts whatsoever in this heavily edited jumble until...."the Ten Commandments say thou shalt not covet, so leave the rich alone!"

Big red X at the top right was my best friend.

[Flycoon]

I'm starting to sweat this one out a bit. The closer 11/4 gets, the more I see the "Bradley Effect" kicking into high gear. Racism runs deep, sometimes it is in a coma until the right buttons are pushed. And it appears Pappy has pushed them for some.

[Hoek]

Qq8Uc5BFogE

[Sotnos]

I dunno whether to laugh or cry at that, a lot of truth in there. I wonder who made it, very clever!

[Maverick9911]

Joe the Plumber...Country Superstar

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/15072.html

:duh:

[Flycoon]

Joe the Plumber...Country Superstar

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1008/15072.html

:duh:

The new Toby Keith.

[Maverick9911]

Very nice prime time spot. Much of it was rehashed if you've been to any of his stump speeches but still powerful nonetheless.

Mentions of McCain, Palin or Bush: Zero

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtREqAmLsoA

[Sotnos]

It was well done, not sure what effect it'll have.

Seems to have caused McCain & the GOP to purchase ad time during the baseball game though. :rolleyes:

[pete]

It'll suck the oxygen out of the media for at least a day. McCain's running out of time.

[Maverick9911]

BLITZER: She was asked what happens in 2012 if you lose on Tuesday, would you simply go back to Alaska? Elizabeth Vargas of ABC News asked her and Palin said this, and I will read it to you verbatim according to an ABC News transcript: "Absolutely not," Sarah Palin says. "I think that, if I were to give up and wave a white flag of surrender against some of the political shots that we've taken, that ... that would ... bring this whole ... I'm not doin' this for naught."

Way to give your state the finger there, Sarah.

[pete]

I have a feeling her state might give her the finger back in a couple of years now that the bloom is off the rose.

[the_narrow_way]

The Obama special last night really hit home for me. It was heartbreaking hearing those family's stories. Chris Matthews was talking about how it spoke to the pride of the family bread-winner. I've endured my earning and spending power go down and down, despite my increase in experience and skills and it really hurts deeply. I almost shed a tear or two. What ever happened to one person's salary being able to not only support his family's basic needs, but be able to save up, get a new vehicle, or move into a new home? The American Dream has almost been stomped out.

It was so nice to not have 30 minutes of hatred and negativity. Bush was not named, nor was McCain. Their failed policies were brought up early, but only briefly. The rest of the time was spent telling Barack's story, the stories of everyday Americans, and hope for the future. :thumb:

That is contrasted by the recent McCain ads and his and Palin's speeches. They spend almost all of their time trying to tear down Obama with fear and smear. There's barely any substance to it, just a bunch of disproven, grey-area, or unprovable statements. Where's the beef John?

[WaiverWire]

I wonder if Vegas has a line as to when the media turns on President Obama.

[pete]

I wonder if Vegas has a line as to when the media turns on President Obama.

I put the over/under at about 200 days.

[Donnie D]

My wife attended the Obama event in Sarasota. There were around 10,000 at Ed Smith Stadium. She said it was like a Beatles concert - lots of women crying, a couple of folks passed out.

What I saw on local access TV was basically a positive message. When he mentioned the failed policies of Bush / McCain, the crowd booed. Obama held up his hands and said "don't boo - just go vote."

Pennsylvania poll out today gives Obama only a 4% lead. 2 others released today show it at 8 - 9%. I suspect that it is somewhere in the middle, but either way it is getting closer.

The good news for McCain is that the undecideds seem to be breaking 3 - 1 for McCain according to some reports. The bad news for McCain is that there aren't enough undecideds at this point to get him to 50% plus 1 in enough states to get to 270.

An amazing stat that I saw this morning - 1/3 of all registered voters in Florida have already voted - and there are still 3 days of early voting left.

[Sotnos]

What I saw on local access TV was basically a positive message. When he mentioned the failed policies of Bush / McCain, the crowd booed. Obama held up his hands and said "don't boo - just go vote."Good answer!

Not sure if anyone saw it, but Clinton gave a good speech last night in (I think) Orlando outlining why Obama would make a great president. I miss ol' President Bubba.

An amazing stat that I saw this morning - 1/3 of all registered voters in Florida have already voted - and there are still 3 days of early voting left.
Wow, that is surprising. I still wonder how long it's going to take at some of the polls, have a feeling I'm going to have a hard time parking here on Tuesday. I doubt it's nearly that many in Pinellas, and going by the phone calls we get here there are a TON of people who have zero clue how this whole voting thingie works.

[Maverick9911]

I think Obama is going to make a play for Arizona. Not sure I agree with that.

Tuesday can't come fast enough.

[pete]

I'd rather Obama make a play for Georgia. The last CNN poll had Obama ahead among registered voters but losing among likely voters. If he stokes up turnout even more, it becomes a barn burner.

Democrats can probably get Arizona in 2012 no matter what. Getting Georgia now in 2008 would be a coup and a half and send shockwaves through the political world. That would mean the Republican Party isn't even safe as a Southeastern regional party.

[pete]

You stay classy, Hillsborough County GOP chair:

http://www2.tbo.com/content/2008/oct/30/text-forwarded-e-mail/

This is the e-mail forwarded by David Storck, chairman of the Hillsborough County Republican Party:

This e-mail was sent to me from one of our Volunteers in the Temple Terrace office. If you think it can help us win this election please pass it on. This election is now in our hands everyone can make a difference.
Thanks
Dave

THE THREAT:
HERE IN TEMPLE TERRACE, FL OUR REPUBLICAN HQ IS ONE BLOCK AWAY FROM OUR LIBRARY, WHICH IS AN EARLY VOTING SITE.

I SEE CARLOADS OF BLACK OBAMA SUPPORTERS COMING FROM THE INNER CITY TO CAST THEIR VOTES FOR OBAMA. THIS IS THEIR CHANCE TO GET A BLACK PRESIDENT AND THEY SEEM TO CARE LITTLE THAT HE IS AT MINIMUM, SOCIALIST, AND PROBABLY MARXIST IN HIS CORE BELIEFS. AFTER ALL, HE IS BLACK--NO EXPERIENCE OR ACCOMPLISHMENTS--BUT HE IS BLACK.
I ALSO SEE YOUNG COLLEGE STUDENTS AND THEIR PROFESSORS FROM USF PARKING THEIR CARS WITH THE PROMINENT 'OBAMA' BUMPER STICKERS. THE STUDENTS ARE ENTHUSIASTIC TO BE VOTING IN A HISTORIC ELECTION WHERE THERE MAY BE THE FIRST BLACK PRESIDENT.

THE COLLEGE PROFESSORS, PARTICULARLY IN THE SOCIAL SCIENCES, FOR THE MOST PART HAVE LITTLE OR NO EXPERIENCE IN THE WORK-A-DAY WORLD.
THEIR LIFE EXPERIENCE HAS BEEN MOSTLY ACADEMIC UNDER THE TUTELAGE OF LIBERAL COLLEGE PROFESSORS. FOR THEM, A LITTLE SOCIALISM AND ANTI-AMERICANISM IS A GOOD THING. AFTER ALL, IF TERRORISTS ATTACK US, WE MUST HAVE DONE SOMETHING TO PROVOKE THEM.

YOU AND I UNDERSTAND THE DANGERS THE POTENTIAL OBAMA PRESIDENCY PRESENTS TO OUR WAY OF LIFE. THE SUPPRESSION OF FREE SPEECH, INTRODUCING UNION INTIMIDATION IN THE WORKPLACE, INCREASED DANGERS TO OUR NATION BY TERRORISTS, CUTTING OUR DEFENSE BUDGET BY 25%, TURNING OUR TAX SYSTEM INTO A NATIONAL WELFARE SYSTEM AND ECONOMIC POLICIES THAT COULD DRIVE US INTO A DEPRESSION.

THERE IS ONLY ONE WAY TO STOP OBAMA: VOTE !!!-------
(AND GET EVERYONE YOU KNOW TO VOTE)
ONLY YOU AND I CAN STOP OBAMA NOW ! !
SEVEN DAYS TO GO AND WE MUST ACT IMMEDIATELY..

A PLAN OF ACTION FOR YOU AND I:
VOTE. OBAMA IS ADVERTISING ON TV ASKING ALL HIS SUPPORTERS TO TAKE A DAY OFF WORK OR CLASS TO VOTE.
CONTACT PERSONALLY EVERYONE YOU KNOW REMINDING THEM TO VOTE AND HOW IMPORTANT IT IS. PARENTS, VOTING-AGE CHILDREN, IN-LAWS, CO-WORKERS, CHURCH CONTACTS, SCHOOL CONTACTS, BUSINESS CONTACTS. MAKE A LIST AND CONTACT THEM.
SEND THIS MESSAGE TO EVERYONE ON YOUR EMAIL LIST THAT WANTS TO DEFEAT OBAMA.

YOUR EMAIL IS AN EFFECTIVE TOOL IF YOU USE IT WISELY AND PROMPTLY. YOU CAN REACH 10,000,000 PEOPLE IN THE NEXT SEVEN DAYS IF AS FEW AS TEN PEOPLE ON YOUR LIST TAKE PROMPT ACTION AND TEN PEOPLE ON THEIR LIST AND TEN PEOPLE ON THEIR LIST...YOU GET THE IDEA.

LET'S ALL PRAY AND WORK AND WE WILL SURELY CELEBRATE OUR VICTORY ON 11/5/08.

David A. Storck Chairman
Hillsborough County
Republican Party



I don't know what's more offensive: the thinly veiled racism, the attack on college educators as anti-American, OR THE ALL CAPITALIZED LETTERS!!!

[Donnie D]

McCain's lack of campaign staff strikes again.

Part 1 - Palin goes to Pittsburg and congratulates the Phillies on winning the world series. The statement gets booed by her supporters.

This is a state they have to win and they don't even understand that Pittsburg and Philly are rivals? In separate sections of the state? You know kind of like Los Angeles and San Fran?

Of course, maybe hockey mom went off on her own again.

Part 2 - McCain introduces Joe the Plumber at a campaign event and he isn't there. According to Joe (who isn't Joe) the Plumber (who isn't a plumber) no one called him to invite him to attend. Or he may have just overslept and is covering his ass, because he evidently doesn't work, he just runs around and is available to meet presidential candidates. And now give foreign policy advice.

I guess because all of his plumbing supplies are made in China, the McCain campaign feels that he has as much foreign policy experience as a woman who can see Russia from her state.

[Sotnos]

Palin goes to Pittsburg and congratulates the Phillies on winning the world series.:dieslaughing:

[WaiverWire]

By Tim Reid, The Times of London

Barack Obama's senior advisers have drawn up plans to lower expectations for his presidency if he wins next week's election, amid concerns that many of his euphoric supporters are harboring unrealistic hopes of what he can achieve.

[pete]

I expect him to get 2 out of 3 agenda items done in his first term: out of Iraq and a sustainable energy policy. Health care will probably need to wait until the second term, although it might be do-able in year three.

[WaiverWire]

We will be out of Irqa no matter who wins. I think Obama's time line on getting out of Irqa will be a little longer than we all think.

Energy policy needs a hugh change. Energy can be a way to get us off the oil and into a better economy all at the same time.

[pete]

Energy can be a way to get us off the oil and into a better economy all at the same time.

I agree. I'd like to see a comprehensive energy package that includes soup to nuts, including a massive investment in modernizing and greening the country's energy infrastructure. I think it's something Obama could roll out and get passed in the first 100 days, and it could bear fruit in 18-24 months after passage in terms of job creation and reduction of oil imports. But he's got to be bold. He can't do it piecemeal. That won't work.

[WaiverWire]

We agree.....we agree :thumb:

How about this:


Notice to All Employees



Notice to All Employees As of November 5, 2008, when President Obama is officially elected into office, our company will install a few new policies which are in keeping with his new, inspiring issues of change and fairness:

1. All salespeople will be pooling their sales and bonuses into a common pool that will be divided equally between all of you. This will serve to give those of you who are underachieving a “fair shake.”

2. All low level workers will be pooling their wages, including overtime, into a common pool, dividing it equally amongst yourselves. This will help those who are “too busy for overtime” to reap the rewards from those who have more spare time and can work extra hours.

3. All top management will now be referred to as “the government.” We will not participate in this “pooling” experience because the law doesn’t apply to us.

4. The “government” will give eloquent speeches to all employees every week, encouraging it’s workers to continue to work hard “for the good of all.”

5. The employees will be thrilled with these new policies because it’s “good to spread the wealth.” Those of you who have underachieved will finally get an opportunity; those of you who have worked hard and had success will feel more “patriotic.”

6. The last few people who were hired should clean out their desks. Don’t feel bad, though, because President Obama will give you free healthcare, free handouts, free oil for heating your home, free food stamps, and he’ll let you stay in your home for as long as you want even if you can’t pay your mortgage.

If you appeal directly to our democratic congress, you might even get a free flat screen TV and a coupon for free haircuts (shouldn’t all Americans be entitled to nice looking hair?).

If for any reason you are not happy with the new policies, you may want to rethink your vote on November 4th.

[Donnie D]

We will be out of Irqa no matter who wins. I think Obama's time line on getting out of Irqa will be a little longer than we all think.

That may be trrue. We need a responsible way to get out of the mess we created.

What Obama signaled is a desire to get out of Iraq more quickly than McCain. The 18 months may turn into 24 months. But the fear that folks have about McCain is that the 24 months will turn into 5 years.

[RSchmitz]

Obama was on the Rachel Maddow show talking about that very thing. He said there would be a "massive project" in states like North Dakota to create energy using windmill technology. The word 5 million new jobs was also used...that is definitely a massive undertaking. During the 25 minute commercial, he mentioned a company that retrofitted schools and businesses with green technology, and that companies like that would be used extensively.

[pete]

As someone who holds one of those jobs already, let me just say that's work I'm more than happy to see coming our way.

[Flycoon]

Notice to All Employees As of November 5, 2008, when President Obama is officially elected into office, our company will install a few new policies which are in keeping with his new, inspiring issues of change and fairness:

1. All salespeople will be pooling their sales and bonuses into a common pool that will be divided equally between all of you. This will serve to give those of you who are underachieving a “fair shake.”

2. All low level workers will be pooling their wages, including overtime, into a common pool, dividing it equally amongst yourselves. This will help those who are “too busy for overtime” to reap the rewards from those who have more spare time and can work extra hours.

3. All top management will now be referred to as “the government.” We will not participate in this “pooling” experience because the law doesn’t apply to us.

4. The “government” will give eloquent speeches to all employees every week, encouraging it’s workers to continue to work hard “for the good of all.”

5. The employees will be thrilled with these new policies because it’s “good to spread the wealth.” Those of you who have underachieved will finally get an opportunity; those of you who have worked hard and had success will feel more “patriotic.”

6. The last few people who were hired should clean out their desks. Don’t feel bad, though, because President Obama will give you free healthcare, free handouts, free oil for heating your home, free food stamps, and he’ll let you stay in your home for as long as you want even if you can’t pay your mortgage.

If you appeal directly to our democratic congress, you might even get a free flat screen TV and a coupon for free haircuts (shouldn’t all Americans be entitled to nice looking hair?).

If for any reason you are not happy with the new policies, you may want to rethink your vote on November 4th.

I hope this was parody/sarcasm and not unbridled stupidity. The "share the wealth" comment was speaking about an increase of taxes (a whopping 3%) on the over $250K crowd and repealing the Bush tax cuts for the over $250K crowd (?). No more than that.

How a $40K ham'n'egger plumbers helper owing back taxes (Ohio State Income Tax) thinks he is going to buy a business when he probably couldn't buy a new Ford Focus is goofy. Even FOX' Shepp Smith was disgusted with "Joe" when he spoke to him about his agreement with another goober's "end of Israel" comment and all Joe could back it up with was if anyone was interested in his reasoning they would have to do their own research. He was unable to explain it.


Same thinking as low income folks who don't want to see the top tax rates raised because they may someday win the Lotto, but they continue to collect Earned Income Credit (Welfare from the IRS, the real sacred cow of the tax code) every year.

[Maverick9911]

I'm getting emails containing everything from the old Soviet anthem to questionnaires about how I support socialism. Not surprisingly, I get zero response to my replies asking to support these "socialism" claims with evidence.

So pretty much nothing has changed since June except these people substituting if for when. I'm all for hearing both sides but damn, I need new friends. When they start echoing all the talking points and calling Palin "a breath of fresh air that's great for the country", its time to flee. :sulk::sulk:

[pete]

New polls have come out today to support the recent ad buys by Obama in Arizona, Georgia, and North Dakota.

Georgia
McCain-47
Obama-44

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/10/31/124032/16/876/647988

Arizona
McCain-48
Obama-47

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/10/31/11279/222/947/647893

And, you can believe it's true because McCain is actually planning to campaign in Arizona on Monday. The vulnerability there is real.

http://www.dcourier.com/main.asp?SectionID=1&subsectionID=1&articleID=60787

From a strategic standpoint, I believe Obama should send Biden to camp out in Pennsylvania until election day to protect his backdoor (maybe split time in Ohio), and ride the shuttle back and forth from North Carolina to Georgia to Florida. He shouldn't be afraid to deploy Bill Clinton to Georgia either. He's already been to Atlanta once to fundraise for Jim Martin. If Obama and Clinton were to do an event in Centennial Olympic Park on Monday with Jim Martin, have mercy. Georgia would be a real barn burner. Don't know if they have the time to set it up, though.

A win in Georgia accomplishes more than a win in Arizona, because it delivers Obama the 59th or 60th (depending on Minnesota) Senate seat to the Democrats and a victory in Georgia proves the GOP is not even safe as a Deep South regional party. I mean, if Obama can run the table from Virginia to North Carolina to Georgia to Florida, that's like 1/3 of the old Confederacy. That completely changes the political assumptions of the past 150 years. That's real change, folks. That means the Civil War is finally over.

[WaiverWire]

Humor, that is all that it is.